My biggest gripe with this episode

[fuchsiaRose]

Clark Kent once again regresses and not by mere coincidence is it in an episode with Lana Lang.

Was I the only one who did a double take when Clark actually was shown contemplating to kill Chloe?? I was like "What???" I had a flashback of Lana telling Clark that Lex had to die, that she had to kill him because he was evil and that he'd end up killing more people. I remembered her telling Clark that unlike him she would DO something about it. And I remember Clark standing firm and not agreeing that killing was ever a choice. This was just last season!!! And I remembered Chloe in many instances urging Clark to take a similar action and yet Clark refused to listen. Then I also had a flashback of Lex Luthor unconscious while the Green Arrow approached, unyielding and wanting to finish him off. To kill Lex Luthor once and for all. Clark Kent stopped him. Clark Kent does not murder. He does not kill.

IN ALL INSTANCES, WITH LANA, CHLOE AND OLIVER, CLARK KNEW BETTER AND DID NOT CONDONE KILLING. EVER. NOT EVEN IN EXTREME SITUATIONS.


Now here, suddenly Clark is doubting something that since day one he has known and believed in? I mean this is no doubt what his parents instilled in him. And yet it's suddenly gone here?? And to top it off, who is the voice of reason? Lana Lang!!! The person who HAS been shown to think that killing someone IS an option. The person who has kidnapped, tortured, stolen. She's the voice of reason? She's the person who knows BETTER than Clark Kent?? :confused:


*shakes head*

And yet people still say that when Lana Lang is around Clark Kent does NOT regress. MOD EDIT

Every time that Lana is around Clark it seems like she HAS to guide him. She HAS to instill in him wisdom. She HAS to show him the way. She HAS to tell him what to do. He's an adult now! He's at the Daily Planet! He's a grown man and it's been 8 years since the show started and Clark still can't think for himself???? Even though he was doing JUST that before Lana? I mean go back to COMMITTED for a second. Clark was investigating. Clark was thinking. Clark was not questioning his morals. Clark was being the character we all know and love.

Now a few episodes later. Lana is back and Clark is suddenly confused? And it's not like this CHLOIAC business is even the worst he's had to deal with. There is no reason why Lana had to be yet again telling Clark what was the right choice.

Clark should know better already. And Clark DOES know better already.

But the second you stick that raven woman in his life he regresses.

Regression is what Lana Lang is to this series.

Regression.



</rant>

[davidbrenton]

Exactly. I feel like I'm filling every thread with my beat down venom this episode brought. We're miles away from the show we had in the first half of the season.

PS3 lost my vote for another season. They can't handle this show. They neglect the only character that actually matters - Clark. Nobody is going to tune in next week. There is nothing to tune in for. They yanked us back to season 7 going nowhereville.

[thehenry89]

I agree with everything the OP said.

[fuchsiaRose]

^^ And I was willing to continue watching Smallville. Heck, I sat through this entire episode even though I got big flashing red signals earlier on that it was a sinking ship.

I will NOT watch Smallville until Infamous. I simply will not continue to watch this character deteriorate before my eyes.

[thehenry89]

I'll watch the next three episdoes, because I'm curious about how this whole clana thing will finally end.

[Clana4Life]

I pretty much responded to most of what you said in the "Clana Revised" thread. But to answer again in this thread. No, I don't think he regressed. I think Lana helped him in this episode, because Clark didn't want to kill Chloe in the first place. Lana just supported him.

[fuchsiaRose]

I pretty much responded to most of what you said in the "Clana Revised" thread. But to answer again in this thread. No, I don't think he regressed. I think Lana helped him in this episode, because Clark didn't want to kill Chloe in the first place. Lana just supported him.
I'm not going into that thread again, "Clana Revised." So I won't be reading what you said unless you repost it here.

[6-Super-Man -5]

Why not!?!?!
Oh well, Season Nine is going to be Clois season, literally, every episode.

[davidbrenton]

I pretty much responded to most of what you said in the "Clana Revised" thread. But to answer again in this thread. No, I don't think he regressed. I think Lana helped him in this episode, because Clark didn't want to kill Chloe in the first place. Lana just supported him.

If Clark didn't think about killing Chloe as an actual option, why the song and dance about "Gee wilber, Lana. Do you think I should? You know, since Brainiac took over my alien dad, I really don't think I can think myself out of this gosh awful mess. Can you advise me? What would the man they say I become do?"

[susangail]

I voted Regress, but cut Clark a break. The point of Smallville is that Clark isn't fully cooked yet. He's going to slip. Let's hope that it's not four episodes worth ;)

[HeartChakraBabe]

I didn't like the whole Clana thing, but on the other hand, I do think she helped him progress. She told him things that he needed to hear, that will push him forward.

[MetropolisGirl4SV]

Regression?

fushiaRose I'm as confused as you about this one. I was thinking is Lana really the one giving him advice...No this can't be happening I had to blink a few times cuz I thought i was in another time zone. :eek: I'm happy she didn't want him to kill Chloe, but I wanted Clark to make the decision on his own in his own terms. I wanted to see the determination of morality and ethics through his own being from what he learned from Jhonathon and Martha. Never Lana *sigh*:\

By the way great post, you pick up on excellent details!

[thehenry89]

If Clark didn't think about killing Chloe as an actual option, why the song and dance about "Gee wilber, Lana. Do you think I should? You know, since Brainiac took over my alien dad, I really don't think I can think myself out of this gosh awful mess. Can you advise me? What should I do again, I forget."

This is the same woman who strapped a bear trap to lionel luthours hand, and tried to convince clark to kill lex. Not to mention the ten million dollars she embezzaled from her ex-husband.

[fuchsiaRose]

I voted Regress, but cut Clark a break. The point of Smallville is that Clark isn't fully cooked yet. He's going to slip. Let's hope that it's not four episodes worth ;)
Yes but just how many times can we regress the character without going, "Come on! Give me a break!"

[davidbrenton]

Why not!?!?!
Oh well, Season Nine is going to be Clois season, literally, every episode.

I honestly don't think PS3 are bright enough to even commit and execute the show to that level of compentency.

[xaosthry]

Thank you. That's all I have to say I was so happy to see Clark's MOD EDIT and was enjoying it entirely then she has to come back. Really, come one!!!!!!! Its almost getting to the point its sad now.
Starting out as a Cholis supporter I really like what they have done with Lois. She has really grown and come into her own just as Clark has. Then Lana comes and I'm so bored with that.

Give us closure and more the MOD EDIT on, thank you and enjoy the flight.

[Gan-EL: the last son]

Everyone seems intent on complaining about Regression with Clark just because Lana's back, but in fact He hasn't done anything regressive at all so far, and seeing as Lana will only be here for another couple episodes or so, I doubt she'll cause any problems. I trust the writers will continue to do the right thing. They've yet to disapoint me this season. Have a little faith everyone ;)

[fuchsiaRose]

I didn't like the whole Clana thing, but on the other hand, I do think she helped him progress. She told him things that he needed to hear, that will push him forward.
What exactly did Lana tell Clark that he hasn't been shown to ALREADY know? Cuz I know it isn't the killing speech and it sure as hell isnt the part about moving on.

You see just because PS3 are SHOWING that Lana is giving Clark advice and making it SEEM like that she is helping him progress doesn't mean that that is the reality!! Not if in order to show this progress you regress the character first!! I know the latter statement is a bit complicated, but am I making sense here? Lana is helping Clark progress but only because PS3 have regressed Clark in this episode!! I mean that is downright insane.

*shakes head*


Oh man, oh man...PS3...what in the world are YOU ALL thinking?????

[Fish1941]

I didn't like the whole Clana thing, but on the other hand, I do think she helped him progress. She told him things that he needed to hear, that will push him forward.


I agree.

[Krypto~Luan]

Nobody is going to tune in next week. There is nothing to tune in for. They yanked us back to season 7 going nowhereville.

Thats what you think:rolleyes:

[davidbrenton]

Since Clark's parents left/died, every character on the show has become Clark's serogate.

[fuchsiaRose]

Everyone seems intent on complaining about Regression with Clark just because Lana's back, but in fact He hasn't done anything regressive at all so far, and seeing as Lana will only be here for another couple episodes or so, I doubt she'll cause any problems. I trust the writers will continue to do the right thing. They've yet to disapoint me this season. Have a little faith everyone ;)

Are you serious? You don't think that Clark Kent actually contemplating killing Chloe is not regression? This is the man who states at the end of the episode that preserving life is his number one rule. Is that a rule you just thought of Clark, huh? Cuz 5 seconds ago with Lana you weren't so certain. :rolleyes: And the reason this is "regression" is because this rule wasn't made up 5 seconds ago. Clark has always been shown to value life and has never yielded under extreme circumstances nor believed that taking a life is ever the right choice.

But I guess here the LOSH didn't know that and Clark didn't know that. Only the wise and all powerful Lana Lang knew. :rolleyes:

Oh brother....and some people are honestly swallowing this??? :confused:

[davidbrenton]

Thats what you think:rolleyes:

Dude, the ratings are going to fall over the next 3 weeks...guarunteed.

I'll be on the episode ratings thread to gladly eat crow if I'm wrong.

[Iluvgreen]

She holds him back.

[fuchsiaRose]

Dude, the ratings are going to fall over the next 3 weeks...guarunteed.

I'll be on the episode ratings thread to gladly eat crow if I'm wrong.
And even if the ratings don't fall who cares. The quality of the show is being reduced to crap.

I don't care at this point about ratings. People have been known to enjoy crap so how it goes is anyone's guess. My concern right now is that this man is in no way, shape or form the man who will turn into Superman.

No glasses, no tights, no flight, no ability to think for himself.

Nope that is NOT Superman.

[hyped4lnc]

I'm sorry, but I didn't really see any regression. His instincts were always right.

[dreamsofnever]

Thanks for this post, fuschia!

I think the problem is that Lana comes back and all of a sudden the writers write to make her look good, and it ends up making everyone else look bad.

I think the point is not that Lana as a character makes Clark regress, but that Lana's presence in the script causes the writers to want to write her up and make her the voice of wisdom, the positive influence, the girl that deserves to be up on that pedestal, and suddenly Clark comes off as dumb, and whoever else is around Lana comes off as dumb.

That whole having Lana advise Clark on not killing, especially one episode after she's lecturing Oliver on not killing... (and not killing LEX, who she tried to kill last season for cripes' sake!) it's just bad writing. It's inconsistent with the way she is sometimes written, and it's basically written in a way to showcase the awesome holiness that is Lana for one of her last episodes.

The problem is that I don't understand how the writers can be so amazing in some ways, but somehow they have this weird fetish for Lana and just write her in all these bizarre ways and then write other characters in these ways that make the other characters look bad so as to make Lana look good.

I just don't get it. At all.

[Alicia Chipy]

If she keeps regressing Clark during the next 3 episodes,he will age backwards like Benjamin Button. We will be dealing with Superbaby soon,people!

[fuchsiaRose]

I'm sorry, but I didn't really see any regression.
Hey, that's your opinion which is always fine, but I did see REGRESSION (major, major mind boggling regression) and my analysis and reaction to what I saw is in the first page.

[davidbrenton]

I wish the writers of Supernatural would write for Clark's character. At least they know how to write for men.

[MetropolisGirl4SV]

Are you serious? You don't think that Clark Kent actually contemplating killing Chloe is not regression? This is the man who states at the end of the episode that preserving life is his number one rule. Is that a rule you just thought of Clark, huh? Cuz 5 seconds ago with Lana you weren't so certain. :rolleyes: And the reason this is "regression" is because this rule wasn't made up 5 seconds ago. Clark has always been shown to value life and has never yielded under extreme circumstances nor believed that taking a life is ever the right choice.

But I guess here the LOSH didn't know that and Clark didn't know that. Only the wise and all powerful Lana Lang knew. :rolleyes:

Oh brother....and some people are honestly swallowing this??? :confused:

I agree, but it is mind-boggling if Clark regresses again...I just hope PS3 don't tread the same deadly path as Al's and Miles:\

[hyped4lnc]

Hey, that's your opinion which is always fine, but I did see REGRESSION (major, major mind boggling regression) and my analysis and reaction to what I saw is in the first page.I read it, and I still don't agree. Sorry.

[Fish1941]

I do have one gripe. Are we to believe that Braniac will no longer pose a threat for Clark?

[unfocused]

I had a flashback of when Chloe wanted Clark to kill Lex.

[fuchsiaRose]

Thanks for this post, fuschia!

I think the problem is that Lana comes back and all of a sudden the writers write to make her look good, and it ends up making everyone else look bad.
Of course this is all speculation, but I think you have a wonderful point. It DOES seem that the writers try to make Lana "look good" at the expense of others. And while that may fly with any other character, when it is done at the expense of Clark Kent (Superman) it is just unbelievable.



I think the point is not that Lana as a character makes Clark regress, but that Lana's presence in the script causes the writers to want to write her up and make her the voice of wisdom, the positive influence, the girl that deserves to be up on that pedestal, and suddenly Clark comes off as dumb, and whoever else is around Lana comes off as dumb.
Yes, but in doing all of this, they invariably DO regress Clark's character. We've seen it time and time again.


That whole having Lana advise Clark on not killing, especially one episode after she's lecturing Oliver on not killing... (and not killing LEX, who she tried to kill last season for cripes' sake!) it's just bad writing. It's inconsistent with the way she is sometimes written, and it's basically written in
It's horrible writing! When did Lana learn this valuable lesson? It's not like she's ever had to pay for her crimes. But now she knows better than Oliver Queen, the LOSH and Clark Kent??? That's a load of crap that I will not swallow. No siree.


The problem is that I don't understand how the writers can be so amazing in some ways, but somehow they have this weird fetish for Lana and just write her in all these bizarre ways and then write other characters in these ways that make the other characters look bad so as to make Lana look good.

I just don't get it. At all.
Catering. They are catering to Kristin Kreuk, to the clana fans are perhaps to AlMiles.

No one knows for certain WHY they are doing it but it's annoying and just plain regressive.

[Krypto~Luan]

and you will all still be watching. He's going closer to be superman, i think their tieing up the past and putting it away. do you people not rememebr the whole interaction between that cosmic woman and Lana.

[xrayvision]

I say neither. I say Clark progressed due to himself. I thinK she did help him remember who he is/was when he was confused on what to do with Chloe. But Clark is the one who stopped the Legion from killing Chloe and how reinforced his "do not kill" as part of the Legion's code.

[fuchsiaRose]

I read it, and I still don't agree. Sorry.
Yes and I said that's fine. But it would help the discussion to actually EXPLAIN why you don't agree instead of just simply stating: I don't agree.

And don't apologize for not agreeing with me. Everyone has their own opinions and own biases. And the bottom line is that I don't care what you think. I know what I feel and what I see and that's good enough for me. No offense...though I know that sounds rude.... *shrugs*

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----

and you will all still be watching. He's going closer to be superman, i think their tieing up the past and putting it away. do you people not rememebr the whole interaction between that cosmic woman and Lana.
I will NOT be watching until Infamous. I've already stated that. I don't feel like wasting an hour a week for the next 3 weeks on crap.

[Gan-EL: the last son]

Are you serious? You don't think that Clark Kent actually contemplating killing Chloe is not regression?
Not at all. When heroes are faced with difficult choices, its only human to second guess themselves. I see nothing wrong with him taking a second to consider all the facts of the situation.

This is the man who states at the end of the episode that preserving life is his number one rule. Is that a rule you just thought of Clark, huh? Cuz 5 seconds ago with Lana you weren't so certain. :rolleyes: And the reason this is "regression" is because this rule wasn't made up 5 seconds ago. Clark has always been shown to value life and has never yielded under extreme circumstances nor believed that taking a life is ever the right choice. I guess one second of weakness is all one needs to point the finger at him and claim he's regressing then. In the end he DIDNT kill her, so there's no point in complaining. He made the right choice and that was that.


But I guess here the LOSH didn't know that and Clark didn't know that. Only the wise and all powerful Lana Lang knew. :rolleyes:
Heaven forbid he turns to his friends and is reassured he's doing the right thing. You honestly can't fault him for that. But since its Lana who was the friend who reassured him, I guess people feel differently. Had it been Ollie instead of Lana, I wonder if this thread would even exist.


Oh brother....and some people are honestly swallowing this??? :confused:
I find it even more difficult to believe anyone would fault Lana for Clark's choices, and yet people do so consistantly.

I'm sorry, but I didn't really see any regression. His instincts were always right.

Nor did I, but blaming Lana is a lot of people's favorite pass time :D

[unfocused]

Yes and I said that's fine. But it would help the discussion to actually EXPLAIN why you don't agree instead of just simply stating: I don't agree.

And don't apologize for not agreeing with me. Everyone has their own opinions and own biases. And the bottom line is that I don't care what you think. I know what I feel and what I see and that's good enough for me. No offense...though I know that sounds rude.... *shrugs*

Why are you asking him for his opinion, but admitting that you don't care about it?

[davidbrenton]

and you will all still be watching. He's going closer to be superman, i think their tieing up the past and putting it away. do you people not rememebr the whole interaction between that cosmic woman and Lana.

Yeah, Lana was still hung up on "Will I be with Clark?"

The only reason we as the audience are misled to believe he's closer to being superman is because every character in the world is saying so. Sorry, nobody has to say anything of the sort so long as the audience sees it in Clark. I'm sorry, I don't. period.

In every scene, he looks confused as to who he is STILL after 8 years. After 8 years, he still has a complex about capes and flight. He still needs all his wisdom to come from others. He is still hopelessly obsessed with the wierdest girl on the planet and has all but forgotten the supposed love of his life- lois lane. oh, but don't worry, he just learned the value of human life, so we're close....not.

[unfocused]

I do. Period.

[fuchsiaRose]

Why are you asking him for his opinion, but admitting that you don't care about it?
I didn't ask for his opinion. I told him that in general it's better to EXPLAIN when you post something instead of simply saying, "I agree" or "I don't care."

And just because I don't care about his opinion does not mean that I won't read his posts or respond to them. Most of us are here on the forum to vent or to pass the time.

[The Striving Artist®]

I'll admit after 10 episodes this season of Clark being the REAL "Superman-In-Training" it seemed slightly out of character for him to want to entertain the thought of killing Chloe.

The REAL cringe worthy part was near the end telling Lana "I hope I can live up to everyone's expectations" speech that had me face-palming.I was seriously expecting Lana to smack him back to reality.

Oh yea what was Lana's heartfelt scene Geoff was talking about? Was he referring to when Lana was talking to Saturn Girl?

[Liquid-Prince]

MOD EDIT Seriously, she had a good part to play this episode, and Clark contemplating killing Chloe is far different then Lex. Lex is human, Chloe was inhabited by Braniac. Lex was at that moment not yet capable emotionally of killing billions of people, yet Braniac is.

Plus Clark had the whispers of the Legion in his and head, and all this caused a moment of weakness, in which he suddenly realized what an idiot he was being when Lana kicked him in the butt. Because of this realization, and probably some guilt in realizing what he had even considered, he cemented his rule, and told the Legion that the number one rule was to not kill.

[dreamsofnever]

I do have one gripe. Are we to believe that Braniac will no longer pose a threat for Clark?

I wondered that too! But then again, there could always be other bits of Braniac left from when Clark destroyed him. I think this was just a piece of Braniac that infected Chloe, but there are still pieces of him that were scattered when Clark destroyed him at the end of last season. They're out there, rebuilding themselves and eventually Braniac will return to pose a threat, because he's Braniac and that's what he does.

Of course this is all speculation, but I think you have a wonderful point. It DOES seem that the writers try to make Lana "look good" at the expense of others. And while that may fly with any other character, when it is done at the expense of Clark Kent (Superman) it is just unbelievable.



Yes, but in doing all of this, they invariably DO regress Clark's character. We've seen it time and time again.


It's horrible writing! When did Lana learn this valuable lesson? It's not like she's ever had to pay for her crimes. But now she knows better than Oliver Queen, the LOSH and Clark Kent??? That's a load of crap that I will not swallow. No siree.


Catering. They are catering to Kristin Kreuk, to the clana fans are perhaps to AlMiles.

No one knows for certain WHY they are doing it but it's annoying and just plain regressive.

Exactly!!! I am still boggled at the why of the writing Lana at the expense of CLARK, the main character.

and you will all still be watching. He's going closer to be superman, i think their tieing up the past and putting it away. do you people not rememebr the whole interaction between that cosmic woman and Lana.

That interaction did leave it all up in the air a bit. She made a big deal again about Lana's influence on him, and didn't say whether or not they would end up together, just that Lana had a fantastically amazing destiny outside of being Clark's girlfriend.

That said, I think you're right that they are goign to (hopefully) tie up the past and put it away. In this episode, it felt like they were opening the Pandora's box of Clana, but hopefully that will change in future episodes.

I will be watching though. I want to see Martian Manhunter and Clark investigating undercover as a police officer!

I'm also going to re-watch this episode because it did have some good moments.

[dru-zod2501]

Are you serious? You don't think that Clark Kent actually contemplating killing Chloe is not regression? This is the man who states at the end of the episode that preserving life is his number one rule. Is that a rule you just thought of Clark, huh? Cuz 5 seconds ago with Lana you weren't so certain. :rolleyes: And the reason this is "regression" is because this rule wasn't made up 5 seconds ago. Clark has always been shown to value life and has never yielded under extreme circumstances nor believed that taking a life is ever the right choice.

But I guess here the LOSH didn't know that and Clark didn't know that. Only the wise and all powerful Lana Lang knew. :rolleyes:

Oh brother....and some people are honestly swallowing this??? :confused:
seriously, your outrage is almost understandable, but I disagree. It sounds like you think murder never even enters a hero's mind EVER...

Superman has killed before, under the most extreme circumstances, so it's not like it's unprecedented. He didn't like doing it, it tore him up for a long time afterward, but given the situation he did what he thought was right to save an innumerable number of people.

Faced with that same possibility, it's not inconceivable for someone even as righteous as Superman to consider killing. Even now, Batman has just resorted to murder to save the world from imminent doom.

The difference is ACTING on those thoughts. And from my perspective Lana is owed a debt of gratitude for reminding him to put his head back on straight before it was too late

[WickedJenn]

MOD NOTE:

14) Flamewars and insults are strictly prohibited. This board is for the discussion of anything about the shows we cover, whether it is positive or negative. Everyone has a right to their opinions, so please do not flame or insult any user, even if you disagree with their point of view. Statements such as "how can you all think this way" or "why does everybody hate" or "you're all just jealous" are prohibited.

[Krypto~Luan]

Yeah, Lana was still hung up on "Will I be with Clark?"

The only reason we as the audience are misled to believe he's closer to being superman is because every character in the world is saying so. Sorry, nobody has to say anything of the sort so long as the audience sees it in Clark. I'm sorry, I don't. period.

In every scene, he looks confused as to who he is STILL after 8 years. After 8 years, he still has a complex about capes and flight. He still needs all his wisdom to come from others. He is still hopelessly obsessed with the wierdest girl on the planet and has all but forgotten the supposed love of his life- lois lane. oh, but don't worry, he just learned the value of human life, so we're close....not.

Doesnt he fully fall in love with her after he becomes superman?..i think...:\

And besides you're asking a man to just up and drop the love of his life (at the moment)
You and alot of other people would like clark to say" Wow what a wonderful morning! What is this weird sensation i have? What...Im no longer in love! And whats this...I have absolutley no emmotion to it at all! Oh Glory!":p

Youll get you mythos, but stop wanting it all at once.


Blame The other two guys, not PS3. their working with what they have. Even if he got Lana in the end and Lois dies idd be fine with it. Even though i love them both. But i would take that as artistic freedom. I mean if they can have superman have different suits, and DC have different Universes, why not smallville stand on its own? I would hate for it to go 100% by mythos, it would be too predictable.


But i still want him with Lois, and i have the comfort of knowing he will get her, i dont need it written all over the screen. It would be a clone of the Clana relationship.IMO

[fuchsiaRose]

Not at all. When heroes are faced with difficult choices, its only human to second guess themselves. I see nothing wrong with him taking a second to consider all the facts of the situation.
He was second guessing something that he has held as a value for a long time. Clark didn't just realize in this episode that killing is never an answer. He's know that for YEARS now. So him contemplating that only to have Lana tell him killing is not right IS regression.



I guess one second of weakness is all one needs to point the finger at him and claim he's regressing then.
The point is not that it's a weakness but that it is OOC (out of character) for Clark to contemplate killing Chloe when he's proven in the past that he does not believe that killing is the answer. Why suddenly now with his best friend on the line is killing her something that he even thinks for a second about?? :confused:


In the end he DIDNT kill her, so there's no point in complaining. He made the right choice and that was that.
That's not the point. The point is that a scene with Clark doubting himself in this and Lana being shown as the voice of wisdom was bad writing. It's OOC for both of them and downright annoying.



Heaven forbid he turns to his friends and is reassured he's doing the right thing. You honestly can't fault him for that. But since its Lana who was the friend who reassured him, I guess people feel differently. Had it been Ollie instead of Lana, I wonder if this thread would even exist.
The problem is that when Lana is around Clark ALWAYS needs reassurance. He stops to think for himself or he doubts himself. What you have just stated IS the problem!


I find it even more difficult to believe anyone would fault Lana for Clark's choices, and yet people do so consistantly.
The main problem is the bad writing that comes with the character of Lana Lang. It's a packaged deal it seems. :rolleyes:



Nor did I, but blaming Lana is a lot of people's favorite pass time :D[/QUOTE]

[Gan-EL: the last son]

MOD EDIT... Seriously, she had a good part to play this episode, and Clark contemplating killing Chloe is far different then Lex. Lex is human, Chloe was inhabited by Braniac. Lex was at that moment not yet capable emotionally of killing billions of people, yet Braniac is.

Plus Clark had the whispers of the Legion in his and head, and all this caused a moment of weakness, in which he suddenly realized what an idiot he was being when Lana kicked him in the butt. Because of this realization, and probably some guilt in realizing what he had even considered, he cemented his rule, and told the Legion that the number one rule was to not kill.

Very well put :)

[fuchsiaRose]

I'll admit after 10 episodes this season of Clark being the REAL "Superman-In-Training" it seemed slightly out of character for him to want to entertain the thought of killing Chloe.

The REAL cringe worthy part was near the end telling Lana "I hope I can live up to everyone's expectations" speech that had me face-palming.I was seriously expecting Lana to smack him back to reality.

Oh yea what was Lana's heartfelt scene Geoff was talking about? Was he referring to when Lana was talking to Saturn Girl?
Yes, in retrospect what in the world WAS that heartfelt moment because I didn't see anything but puke worthy crap.

----- Added 2 Minutes later -----

seriously, your outrage is almost understandable, but I disagree. It sounds like you think murder never even enters a hero's mind EVER...

Superman has killed before, under the most extreme circumstances, so it's not like it's unprecedented. He didn't like doing it, it tore him up for a long time afterward, but given the situation he did what he thought was right to save an innumerable number of people.

Faced with that same possibility, it's not inconceivable for someone even as righteous as Superman to consider killing. Even now, Batman has just resorted to murder to save the world from imminent doom.

The difference is ACTING on those thoughts. And from my perspective Lana is owed a debt of gratitude for reminding him to put his head back on straight before it was too late
The problem was not that he could conceive of such a notion. The problem is the timing. He's doing that NOW. After 8 years of knowing better and proving that he knows better. After 8 years of having instances when he DOES contemplate that or others around him contemplate that and he has always come to the same conclusion: Killing is never alright.

Now when his best friend (one of the closest people in his life), now that he is a grown man NOW he contemplates this and when he's with Lana Lang nonetheless who coincidentally is there to show him the error of his thinking? Please....


The timing was just off. It was more than likely a scene written to make Lana look good. But people will NOT like Lana just by turning her into an overnight "voice of wisdom" because most people will call it on what it is: BALONEY!

[Gan-EL: the last son]

The point is not that it's a weakness but that it is OOC (out of character) for Clark to contemplate killing Chloe when he's proven in the past that he does not believe that killing is the answer. Why suddenly now with his best friend on the line is killing her something that he even thinks for a second about?? :confused:
How is it out of character when he's never been in that situation before? It would only be regression if he actually killed her, he didn't break his own personal rules, he didn't even bend them a little.


That's not the point. The point is that a scene with Clark doubting himself in this and Lana being shown as the voice of wisdom was bad writing. It's OOC for both of them and downright annoying.
Lana's grown up from what I've seen. The way she was written in Bride is in sinc with her comments to Clark in this episode as well.



The problem is that when Lana is around Clark ALWAYS needs reassurance. He stops to think for himself or he doubts himself. What you have just stated IS the problem!
He's done so when he's been around others too, his parents, chloe, how is it any different here?


The main problem is the bad writing that comes with the character of Lana Lang. It's a packaged deal it seems. :rolleyes:
imo, they're finally writing her right. Now that Gough and Miles are gone, SV's focusing more on clark and less on both lana and chloe.

[suzieQ]

MOD EDIT... Seriously, she had a good part to play this episode, and Clark contemplating killing Chloe is far different then Lex. Lex is human, Chloe was inhabited by Braniac. Lex was at that moment not yet capable emotionally of killing billions of people, yet Braniac is.

Plus Clark had the whispers of the Legion in his and head, and all this caused a moment of weakness, in which he suddenly realized what an idiot he was being when Lana kicked him in the butt. Because of this realization, and probably some guilt in realizing what he had even considered, he cemented his rule, and told the Legion that the number one rule was to not kill.

Nice post.

This was truly a defining moment for Clark.....one that he won't EVER go back on! He had not been in a situation where he had to make that kind of choice.....probably his hardest.......risk someone he loves for the lives of many. THIS IS HIS MANTRA, he won't take a life. This is not regression, but a situation that makes it all much more clear to Clark,......he is now truly starting to understand his destiny, his future....not just because he was told about it .....because he feels like his gut feeling is right and Clark had a moment of weakness. He won't again. This is PROGRESSION!

I don't see one thing wrong with Lana telling him that she knows he can do what he has to do to save both!

Many of you are just splitting hairs about this term "regression", it doesn't hold water!

[The Striving Artist®]

The problem is,is that were so friggin used to Clana that when Clark finally decides that Lana ISN'T the one for him and they become good friends,fans will still backlash because of there history of how she was written.

[fuchsiaRose]

How is it out of character when he's never been in that situation before? It would only be regression if he actually killed her, he didn't break his own personal rules, he didn't even bend them a little.
He has been in a situation when killing someone seems like a solution. Each time he has stated firmly that it is NOT. The point is not that he did or didn't kill it. The point is that he contemplated doing so when this is something that has been contemplated before and which he has come to an answer: You do not kill and what added to the ridiculous factor is that it was Chloe, his best friend. He doesn't think killing Lex is ever an option and yet Chloe is? And Clark was firm that there HAD to be another solution with the LOSH. There always is in these types of stories. Clark knows this. Thus the discussion with Lana was OOC and didn't make sense. It seemed to carry the agenda of promoting one character at the expense of another.

imo, they're finally writing her right. Now that Gough and Miles are gone, SV's focusing more on clark and less on both lana and chloe.
Yes, writing her "right" at the expense of other characters like Clark Kent like a previous poster mentioned. :rolleyes:

[Krypto~Luan]

MOD EDIT... Seriously, she had a good part to play this episode, and Clark contemplating killing Chloe is far different then Lex. Lex is human, Chloe was inhabited by Braniac. Lex was at that moment not yet capable emotionally of killing billions of people, yet Braniac is.

Plus Clark had the whispers of the Legion in his and head, and all this caused a moment of weakness, in which he suddenly realized what an idiot he was being when Lana kicked him in the butt. Because of this realization, and probably some guilt in realizing what he had even considered, he cemented his rule, and told the Legion that the number one rule was to not kill.

And this is why i thought you were awesome [MOD EDIT] :lol:



ITs closure, 7 years of love is a big deal. Cant just wake up in the morning and be over it. I love lana, she played a great role


Must bother people that Lana is gonna play a major role in history in the SV univrse :lol:

[fuchsiaRose]

The problem is,is that were so friggin used to Clana that when Clark finally decides that Lana ISN'T the one for him and they become good friends,fans will still backlash because of there history of how she was written.
If the season ends this year that shouldn't be a problem. Only so little time to complain, you see....not that complaining hasn't been going on since Lois Lane arrived. :rolleyes:

If there is a season nine, who knows...but KK is out (minus a possible return for a series finale according to one source) so whether people whine or not wont bring clana back once it's dead. And dead it will be in 3 episodes to be exact.

----- Added 2 Minutes later -----

Must bother people that Lana is gonna play a major role in history in the SV univrse :lol:
Lana has already played a major role. So much so that while her character started well enough it was sullied and tainted in every way possible. That's why it's hard to see Lana so mature and wise now. It's OOC with the way she's been in SV.

And in the comics, not too wise either. She is a divorcee with a child named after a man that is not her child's father and is a wannabe home wrecker. It doesn't fly that Lana has a "great future" ahead of her. Not by what she's done in SV and not by what we have seen IS her future in the comics.

[you_smell_terrific]

I'm just sick of the show shoving down our throats that LANA plays a huge part in Clark becoming Superman. Lana has always caused regression in Clark.

On Smallville the people I've seen that would help Clark to become Superman are:
His parents - taught him all of his morals

Chloe - accepted him for who he was and always believed he would do something great, and got him interested in reporting

Various JLA and other guest stars - Oliver taught him to actually DO something outside of his little bubble

Jor-El - even if it wasn't what Clark wanted, Jor-El has instilled the destiny stuff into him

Lois - nudged him in the direction of the Daily Planet after Chloe

Even Lex - showed him the opposite of what he wanted to become


Lana's sudden wisdom on what Clark needs to do to be a hero and what we're supposed to believe is her self sacrifice when she left Clark is just the writers attempt to erase all of the terrible **** she's done in the last few seasons. People above me mentioned some of the things.

[Liquid-Prince]

And this is why i thought you were awesome [MOD EDIT] :lol:



ITs closure, 7 years of love is a big deal. Cant just wake up in the morning and be over it. I love lana, she played a great role


Must bother people that Lana is gonna play a major role in history in the SV univrse :lol:

:p

[Krypto~Luan]

Lana has already played a major role. So much so that while her character started well enough it was sullied and tainted in every way possible. That's why it's hard to see Lana to mature and wise now. It's OOC with the way she's been in SV.

And in the comics, not to wise either. She is a divorcee with a child named after a man that is not her child's father and is a wannabe homewrecker. It doesn't fly that Lana has a "great future" ahead of her. Not by what she's done in SV and not by what we have seen IS her future in the comics.
What i meant was that after he relationship with clark. The exact words Irma said about her future being great. proves that she's gonna live. Smallville doesnt always go by mythos. In some mythos, Johnathan is alive, martha is dead, others theyre both dead etc. So what i was doing was poking at the people who want Lana dead on the show.:cool:

[fuchsiaRose]

I'm just sick of the show shoving down our throats that LANA plays a huge part in Clark becoming Superman. Lana has always caused regression in Clark.

On Smallville the people I've seen that would help Clark to become Superman are:
His parents - taught him all of his morals

Chloe - accepted him for who he was and always believed he would do something great, and got him interested in reporting

Various JLA and other guest stars - Oliver taught him to actually DO something outside of his little bubble

Jor-El - even if it wasn't what Clark wanted, Jor-El has instilled the destiny stuff into him

Lois - nudged him in the direction of the Daily Planet after Chloe

Even Lex - showed him the opposite of what he wanted to become


Lana's sudden wisdom on what Clark needs to do to be a hero and what we're supposed to believe is her self sacrifice when she left Clark is just the writers attempt to erase all of the terrible **** she's done in the last few seasons. People above me mentioned some of the things.

And that about sums it up!! :cool:

[Gan-EL: the last son]

He has been in a situation when killing someone seems like a solution. Each time he has stated firmly that it is NOT. The point is not that he did or didn't kill it. The point is that he contemplated doing so when this is something that has been contemplated before and which he has come to an answer: You do not kill and what added to the ridiculous factor is that it was Chloe, his best friend. He doesn't think killing Lex is ever an option and yet Chloe is? And Clark was firm that there HAD to be another solution with the LOSH. There always is in these types of stories. Clark knows this. Thus the discussion with Lana was OOC and didn't make sense. It seemed to carry the agenda of promoting one character at the expense of another.
The difference between Lex and Brainiac/Chloe is that Brainiac was going to destroy the earth. That kind of burden would drive anyone to do what he did. It is complaring apples and oranges. It isn't the same thing.


Yes, writing her "right" at the expense of other characters like Clark Kent like a previous poster mentioned. :rolleyes:
Personally, I think that's a bit of a reach. He's no different at all.

[Liquid-Prince]

I'm just sick of the show shoving down our throats that LANA plays a huge part in Clark becoming Superman. Lana has always caused regression in Clark.

On Smallville the people I've seen that would help Clark to become Superman are:
His parents - taught him all of his morals

Chloe - accepted him for who he was and always believed he would do something great, and got him interested in reporting

Various JLA and other guest stars - Oliver taught him to actually DO something outside of his little bubble

Jor-El - even if it wasn't what Clark wanted, Jor-El has instilled the destiny stuff into him

Lois - nudged him in the direction of the Daily Planet after Chloe

Even Lex - showed him the opposite of what he wanted to become


Lana's sudden wisdom on what Clark needs to do to be a hero and what we're supposed to believe is her self sacrifice when she left Clark is just the writers attempt to erase all of the terrible **** she's done in the last few seasons. People above me mentioned some of the things.

She's been damaged far more then she has caused damage, and her even having the ability to act this mature is an amazing feat on it's own.

[fuchsiaRose]

What i meant was that after he relationship with clark. The exact words Irma said about her future being great. proves that she's gonna live. Smallville doesnt always go by mythos. In some mythos, Johnathan is alive, martha is dead, others theyre both dead etc. So what i was doing was poking at the people who want Lana dead on the show.:cool:
*shrugs*

Uh okay. I was never under the impression that Lana would die. I just know that she's gone in 3! :D

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----

The difference between Lex and Brainiac/Chloe is that Brainiac was going to destroy the earth. That kind of burden would drive anyone to do what he did. It is complaring apples and oranges. It isn't the same thing.


Personally, I think that's a bit of a reach. He's no different at all.

This is your opinion to which I fully and completely disagree with, but since I've already explained numerous times why, I'm ending this particular conversation here as we're only going in circles...

[Krypto~Luan]

She's been damaged far more then she has caused damage, and her even having the ability to act this mature is an amazing feat on it's own.

I think people fail to relize is that clark is hurtling to the future fast, he needs to patch things up with lana, and doing it in one episode is pathetic. Its seven years, we have had some bad fillers, i would take 8 episodes of lana and clark closing their relationship anyday compaired to the crapy filliers they have given us. At least it makes for good story.

[fuchsiaRose]

She's been damaged far more then she has caused damage, and her even having the ability to act this mature is an amazing feat on it's own.
And that is how pathetic Lana Lang has become, isnt it?

*sighs*

Whatever...my point was simply that this little scene was ridiculous and laughable.

[pizzahead2490]

my you guys give up on this show so easily:p i may not like that clark regress and he did alittle in this eppy but i am still gonna watch the next 3 episodes. legion was awesome in my book more awesome than bride by far. there is no way i am gonna say no s9 just cuz i didnt like this... and how do you guys know that the other three episodes is gonna be bad??? it may be good. I DO NOT THINK THIS EPISODE WAS LIKE SAESON 7!!!!. it was great.

there was a little clana in this episode... i didnt like it but i knew it was gonna happen and honestly it wasnt all that bad.

i do agree that i wish that lana will stop telling clark to do things but give clark some slack.

if this episode taught me anything its that what you read in the history books/comic books is not always show everything.

clark is not perfect and he is not superman as yet either.

BUT DO NOT GIVE UP HOPE. he will become superman soon before we know it.

[Gan-EL: the last son]

What i meant was that after he relationship with clark. The exact words Irma said about her future being great. proves that she's gonna live. Smallville doesnt always go by mythos. In some mythos, Johnathan is alive, martha is dead, others theyre both dead etc. So what i was doing was poking at the people who want Lana dead on the show.:cool:

They also left it open for them to do with chloe how ever they want to via the "We have never heard a thing about Chloe Sullivan" line. They could kill her off or keep her if they want to.


BUT DO NOT GIVE UP HOPE. he will become superman soon before we know it.

That I'll always have hope for :)

[Krypto~Luan]

*shrugs*

Uh okay. I was never under the impression that Lana would die. I just know that she's gone in 3! :D

That was ment to be a joke you didnt get. But thats fine with me


Gone in three...? Pshhh for now. They'll bring her back eventually,

[smallvillefreak24]

ok don't be too hard on him billions of people were at risk and he didn't kill her did he .. no! so settle down - yes it was surprising/disappointing that he would consider it but come on when future people say its chloe or end of world-hello but yes clark prevailed in the end..

[davidbrenton]

BUT DO NOT GIVE UP HOPE. he will become superman soon before we know it.

I know. I don't know what's up with me. I'm so down on it today. I've gotta recollect my thoughts, get some sleep and get re-energized about the show.

The baffling thing is, I actually really enjoyed the first 40 minutes or so. For some reason, I just didn't leave the show with any emotional memory of enjoyment.

I NEED SLEEP. Good night.

[dru-zod2501]

The problem was not that he could conceive of such a notion. The problem is the timing. He's doing that NOW. After 8 years of knowing better and proving that he knows better. After 8 years of having instances when he DOES contemplate that or others around him contemplate that and he has always come to the same conclusion: Killing is never alright.

Now when his best friend (one of the closest people in his life), now that he is a grown man NOW he contemplates this and when he's with Lana Lang nonetheless who coincidentally is there to show him the error of his thinking? Please....


The timing was just off. It was more than likely a scene written to make Lana look good. But people will NOT like Lana just by turning her into an overnight "voice of wisdom" because most people will call it on what it is: BALONEY!
as I tried to illustrate in my post, the thought will likely enter his mind many, many more times in his life, well into his Superman career, as the threats become deadlier to more and more people, and I'm sure that 99.99999999% of the time he'll be able to handle the temptation, but when he doesn't it's good to have the right people around to set him straight. I agree to disagree on this point.

[cksidekick]

^^^^ well said...

what is up with all the Lana hate? can't a girl catch a break? she didn't tell Clark what to do, she reinforced what he already knew he should do...what some are calling regression lasted an entire conversation...he didn't regress...he took his problem to a trusted friend, asked a what if question, and was given the advice to do as he always does...then he did...

[fuchsiaRose]

[QUOTE=fuchsiaRose;4336332]*shrugs*

Uh okay. I was never under the impression that Lana would die. I just know that she's gone in 3! :D
QUOTE]
That was ment to be a joke you didnt get. But thats fine with me
If it was a joke then I'm glad I didn't get it.


Gone in three...? Pshhh for now. They'll bring her back eventually,
Whatever helps you sleep at night! :p

[Liquid-Prince]

And that is how pathetic Lana Lang has become, isnt it?

*sighs*

Whatever...my point was simply that this little scene was ridiculous and laughable.

Do you actually want to sit there and say she pathetic. Her parent got killed by meteors, she's been lied to, dumped multiple times, watched two of her boyfriends die, injected with hormones and forced to marry Lex, then accused of injecting the hormones herself, threatened by Lionel, finally gotten with Clark only to have herself be put into a state of extreme pain with no way of expressing it. She's known Clark has a greater sense of duty, has left him, and even now your bashing her.

Half of that happened while she didn't even know Clark's secret...

[you_smell_terrific]

She's been damaged far more then she has caused damage, and her even having the ability to act this mature is an amazing feat on it's own.

That IS true. All of the seasons before she knew his secret, Clark put her through a lot of ****. If you put yourself in her shoes, Clark had to have hurt her many times for reasons that are completely unknown to her. Still though, Clark did terrible things to Chloe too, but she didn't turn into an embezzling ninja Lex stalker LOL.

Wrath pretty much summed up Lana's true person to me. She gets super abilities and suddenly she's a certified badass that just goes to kill Lex. She even fought Clark if I remember right. The fact that after she lost the powers they through out the famous 'you weren't yourself line' just made me want to vomit. Lana WAS herself, she just had limitless power. Her true colors came out in that episode and no matter what fake sweet face she puts on, I can't help but be completely sick of her.

It's not always her fault that Clark goes backwards, but her being there causes him to for some reason. Like in Action when he gets the fake cape, he leaves it on the fence and walks away to go inside and play housewife with Lana. I remember thinking that scene was so epic when it first aired, but in fact it's symbolism for him walking away from his destiny to be normal. That's all Lana is to Clark. He always wanted to be normal and making waffles in the morning with Lana fufills that fantasy lmao.

It's sickening to me that they've drawn out this tired relationship this long. The fact that they kiss in the previews for next week just prove the point of regression further. We'll just be returning to the crapfest that was season 7. The Clana sob story *rolls eyes* gag me.

[fuchsiaRose]

as I tried to illustrate in my post, the thought will likely enter his mind many, many more times in his life, well into his Superman career, as the threats become deadlier to more and more people, and I'm sure that 99.99999999% of the time he'll be able to handle the temptation, but when he doesn't it's good to have the right people around to set him straight. I agree to disagree on this point.
I understand. My point was that the timing was awful and that it seemed to carry with it the agenda of making Lana be the voice of reason.

But yeah, let's just agree to disagree. Otherwise we'll continue discussing this until the moons come home. Wait, is that the expression? Oh deary, I was never too go with those! :lol:

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----

Do you actually want to sit there and say she pathetic. Her parent got killed by meteors, she's been lied to, dumped multiple times, watched two of her boyfriends die, injected with hormones and forced to marry Lex, then accused of injecting the hormones herself, threatened by Lionel, finally gotten with Clark only to have herself be put into a state of extreme pain with no way of expressing it. She's known Clark has a greater sense of duty, has left him, and even now your bashing her.

Half of that happened while she didn't even know Clark's secret...
Lol. Calm down.

Yes, I believe that the character is pathetic. I didn't say it was HER fault. That's just how she's been written. She's a victim and really the only reason why sometimes something else shines through is because of Kristin's influence who believes (ironically) in empowering women.

[Krypto~Luan]

[QUOTE=Krypto~Luan;4336358]
If it was a joke then I'm glad I didn't get it.


Whatever helps you sleep at night! :p

If she's not back im fine with it, if she is im fine with it. I dont complain unless there is good story poping out.

I love lana an KK. So whatever the new people want to do is fine with me. I dont care so much about mythos and a character the way others do. Im not a Lana basher. :D

They can throw her in for the entire season and beyond, I dont care. Good story akes good ratings. Lana has good story written all over her. They have a complex relationship. They could have done anything they wanted wth it. they chose this, and i enjoy it. :cool:

[Gan-EL: the last son]

Do you actually want to sit there and say she pathetic. Her parent got killed by meteors, she's been lied to, dumped multiple times, watched two of her boyfriends die, injected with hormones and forced to marry Lex, then accused of injecting the hormones herself, threatened by Lionel, finally gotten with Clark only to have herself be put into a state of extreme pain with no way of expressing it. She's known Clark has a greater sense of duty, has left him, and even now your bashing her.

Half of that happened while she didn't even know Clark's secret...

And yet so many people hate Lana and blame her for all that, I'll never understand it.

[fuchsiaRose]

That IS true. All of the seasons before she knew his secret, Clark put her through a lot of ****. If you put yourself in her shoes, Clark had to have hurt her many times for reasons that are completely unknown to her. Still though, Clark did terrible things to Chloe too, but she didn't turn into an embezzling ninja Lex stalker LOL.

Wrath pretty much summed up Lana's true person to me. She gets super abilities and suddenly she's a certified badass that just goes to kill Lex. She even fought Clark if I remember right. The fact that after she lost the powers they through out the famous 'you weren't yourself line' just made me want to vomit. Lana WAS herself, she just had limitless power. Her true colors came out in that episode and no matter what fake sweet face she puts on, I can't help but be completely sick of her.

It's not always her fault that Clark goes backwards, but her being there causes him to for some reason. Like in Action when he gets the fake cape, he leaves it on the fence and walks away to go inside and play housewife with Lana. I remember thinking that scene was so epic when it first aired, but in fact it's symbolism for him walking away from his destiny to be normal. That's all Lana is to Clark. He always wanted to be normal and making waffles in the morning with Lana fufills that fantasy lmao.

It's sickening to me that they've drawn out this tired relationship this long. The fact that they kiss in the previews for next week just prove the point of regression further. We'll just be returning to the crapfest that was season 7. The Clana sob story *rolls eyes* gag me.

Oh don't even get me started on the kiss next week. Regression galore!! That is why I won't watch Smallville until Infamous. :D

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----

Lana has good story written all over her. They have a complex relationship. They could have done anything they wanted wth it. they chose this, and i enjoy it. :cool:


MOD EDIT

[you_smell_terrific]

Exactly. I still love Smallville though, so I will suffer through the clana ********.

I can't even count how many times I rolled my eyes during tonight's episode when the Cosmo Girl kept saying Lana was what made him Supes. What about everyone else?! LOL

What's funny, is the first time CG was telling all of this to Lana (at Isis) I think she was just buttering her up to get her to convince Clark to kill Chloe. I do believe that she knew who Lana was from the history books, but she was reading her mind the entire time. I got the impression she was just buttering Lana up so she would do her a favor. Lana even realizes she knew too much and said 'you're reading my mind...'.

[fuchsiaRose]

Exactly. I still love Smallville though, so I will suffer through the clana ********.

I can't even count how many times I rolled my eyes during tonight's episode when the Cosmo Girl kept saying Lana was what made him Supes. What about everyone else?! LOL

What's funny, is the first time CG was telling all of this to Lana (at Isis) I think she was just buttering her up to get her to convince Clark to kill Chloe. I do believe that she knew who Lana was from the history books, but she was reading her mind the entire time. I got the impression she was just buttering Lana up so she would do her a favor. Lana even realizes she knew too much and said 'you're reading my mind...'.
Oooh CG was just buttering Lana up?? I hadn't thought about that possibility? Hmm...now THAT will help me sleep better at night! Thanks! :D:lol:

[Gan-EL: the last son]

That IS true. All of the seasons before she knew his secret, Clark put her through a lot of ****. If you put yourself in her shoes, Clark had to have hurt her many times for reasons that are completely unknown to her. Still though, Clark did terrible things to Chloe too, but she didn't turn into an embezzling ninja Lex stalker LOL.

Yeah, instead Chloe ended her relationship with clark before it ever really started, then guilted him over it when it was HER that made the choice, not him. She also joined forces with Lionel while in a jealous rage after Clark started dating Lana, tried to use her "truth" abilities to discover Clark's secret, and in addition she kept Clark's location in metropolis a secret from both Lana & his parents for 3 months. She's a real saint. LOL

[fuchsiaRose]

Yeah, instead Chloe ended her relationship with clark before it ever really started, then guilted him over it when it was HER that made the choice, not him. She also joined forces with Lionel while in a jealous rage after Clark started dating Lana, tried to use her "truth" abilities to discover Clark's secret, and in addition she kept Clark's location in metropolis a secret from both Lana & his parents for 3 months. She's a real saint. LOL
Ah, Smallville. The show full of such admirable characters. Seriously, I see them all around a far as the I can see...

Man just bring back Shelbs already!! He's the best among the SV clan.

bark!! :lol:

[you_smell_terrific]

True, but Chloe recovered and became his best friend and secret keeper. That was all before she knew his secret. Not that that's much of an excuse, but still. I hated Chloe when she turned evil***** LOL!!

I didn't really care for Chloe until season 4 when HER true colors came out. Her deep loyalty. Lana took a different approach...

[Liquid-Prince]

True, but Chloe recovered and became his best friend and secret keeper. That was all before she knew his secret. Not that that's much of an excuse, but still. I hated Chloe when she turned evil***** LOL!!

Chloe was never forced to marry Lex...

[fuchsiaRose]

Chloe was never forced to marry Lex...
No one forced Lana Lang to sleep with Lex Luthor prior to the wedding.

[Liquid-Prince]

No one forced Lana Lang to sleep with Lex Luthor prior to the wedding.

Sure they did. His name was Clark.

[Krypto~Luan]

And this (you quoting me) officially signals that THIS conversation has come full circle! :lol:



Perhaps..but tell me this, would any good relationship, or a bad one for that matter, ever just end? Just die, fade away into dust?

A good relationship, a deep one, will burrow so deep that everything the bond does will do something to the person.

that love lasted more then 8 years. It wont just go away that fast. Clark even had a new love Alicia ( I think we saw her pic in the epsiode) It didnt work, even then his heart belonged to Lana. Yes I know the love was dragged out by the other 2 Miles and Al. But
Ps3 are doing what they see fit with it. They cant wake up in the morning and be fine with it. It has to be a progress, like it is in the real world.

When love dies, it takes a while for the love to lose hold. Even then you still love that person. ITs not as strong and it easier to love again. I love lana, But this will show clark why Lois is better.


Curious, did you like the film Titanic? Did you like it?

[you_smell_terrific]

She made her decision to sleep with Lex, Clark didn't make her. He pushed her away. It wasn't his fault if she went to Lex.

[Gan-EL: the last son]

Oh don't even get me started on the kiss next week. Regression galore!! That is why I won't watch Smallville until Infamous. :D

Jumping ahead a little bit arent we? lol Seeing as the episode hasn't aired yet its a bit soon to assume that.

It seems no one has heard of a goodbye kiss either.

[Liquid-Prince]

She made her decision to sleep with Lex, Clark didn't make her. He pushed her away. It wasn't his fault if she went to Lex.

Clark knew that Lex had a thing for Lana and was seducing her, and he broke up with her and basically tossed her into Lex's arms. Hurt from the brutal breakup, Lana found a temporary solace in Lex, and mistook it for passionate love.

[Krypto~Luan]

No one forced Lana Lang to sleep with Lex Luthor prior to the wedding.

She was hurting. Its not like she was thinking right.

[fuchsiaRose]

Sure they did. His name was Clark.
:rotfl:

For my sanity I HAVE to believe that the above statement is a joke. Man, do I have to. Oh man....:rolleyes:

[Krypto~Luan]

Clark knew that Lex had a thing for Lana and was seducing her, and he broke up with her and basically tossed her into Lex's arms. Hurt from the brutal breakup, Lana found a temporary solace in Lex, and mistook it for passionate love.

Cha-ching you are correct sir!

[fuchsiaRose]

She was hurting. Its not like she was thinking right.
She was hurting and SHE made a choice. She chose to sleep with Lex. No one forced her.

And really I don't want to play Clark Kent right now (you know with the whole, "Lana nothing is ever your fault. It's all me" stuff).

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----

Clark knew that Lex had a thing for Lana and was seducing her, and he broke up with her and basically tossed her into Lex's arms. Hurt from the brutal breakup, Lana found a temporary solace in Lex, and mistook it for passionate love.
The girl made a mistake. She made a wrong CHOICE.

For you to say that her sleeping with Lex was because Clark made her do it makes the character seem even MORE pathetic.

----- Added 2 Minutes later -----

Perhaps..but tell me this, would any good relationship, or a bad one for that matter, ever just end? Just die, fade away into dust?

A good relationship, a deep one, will burrow so deep that everything the bond does will do something to the person.

that love lasted more then 8 years. It wont just go away that fast. Clark even had a new love Alicia ( I think we saw her pic in the epsiode) It didnt work, even then his heart belonged to Lana. Yes I know the love was dragged out by the other 2 Miles and Al. But
Ps3 are doing what they see fit with it. They cant wake up in the morning and be fine with it. It has to be a progress, like it is in the real world.

When love dies, it takes a while for the love to lose hold. Even then you still love that person. ITs not as strong and it easier to love again. I love lana, But this will show clark why Lois is better.


Curious, did you like the film Titanic? Did you like it?

Dude seriously this particular conversation has dried up.

[you_smell_terrific]

She was hurting and SHE made a choice. She chose to sleep with Lex. No one forced her.

And really I don't want to play Clark Kent right now (you know with the whole, "Lana nothing is ever your fault. It's all me" stuff).

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


The girl made a mistake. She made a wrong CHOICE.

For you to say that her sleeping with Lex was because Clark made her do it makes the character seem even MORE pathetic.

So glad I'm not the only one who thinks so LOL. I mean hell, I could sleep with anyone I wanted to just because my heart was broken and it not be any fault of my own? Hell yes! Bring on the Lana Lang Logic!

*shakes head*

[Krypto~Luan]

She was hurting and SHE made a choice. She chose to sleep with Lex. No one forced her.

And really I don't want to play Clark Kent right now (you know with the whole, "Lana nothing is ever your fault. It's all me" stuff).

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


The girl made a mistake. She made a wrong CHOICE.

For you to say that her sleeping with Lex was because Clark made her do it makes the character seem even MORE pathetic.When people are hurting emmotionally thy cant think straight, it was a gap she wanted to fill, Jason was a substitue he was out to get her, and lex was a sub also, but this relationship also showed how evil lex was, how insane he was. Its not htat difficult a concept to grasp.:\

[tbird4u]

Clark knew that Lex had a thing for Lana and was seducing her, and he broke up with her and basically tossed her into Lex's arms. Hurt from the brutal breakup, Lana found a temporary solace in Lex, and mistook it for passionate love.

:rotfl: Umm Ok whatever helps YOU sleeps better at night. I am however intrested in Lanas secret. Im hoping it will be good

[fuchsiaRose]

When people are hurting emmotionally thy cant think straight, it was a gap she wanted to fill, Jason was a substitue he was out to get her, and lex was a sub also, but this relationship also showed how evil lex was, how insane he was. Its not htat difficult a concept to grasp.:\

Yes but the failure in logic is when someone states that because someone is emotionally impaired their actions can be blamed on others. This is illogical.

Example: Clark dumps Lana. Lana decides to commit suicide because she can't stand life without him. Is the suicide Clark's fault? No. He did NOT pull the trigger. He caused the mental anguish but in the end we ALL make choices. Those choices and their consequences are no one's fault but our own.

MOD EDIT

[Krypto~Luan]

Yes but the failure in logic is when someone states that because someone is emotionally impaired their actions can be blamed on others. This is illogical.

Example: Clark dumps Lana. Lana decides to commit suicide because she can't stand life without him. Is the suicide Clark's fault? No. He did NOT pull the trigger. He caused the mental anguish but in the end we ALL make choices. Those choices and their consequences are no one's fault but our own.

Tsk tsk tsk, i never said that, Someone else did.
I'm saying that the realationship is the reason.

[you_smell_terrific]

Are you saying that Lana had no real feelings for Lex? I think that is completely wrong. Even after she had finally escaped him and broken up, she STILL spyed on him at Isis for months. She clearly still felt something for him. They were two peas in a pod at that point; both evil. She's dialed it down and is suddenly a hero and all is forgiven (whatever).

But I'm nearly positive that Lana loved Lex as well. Just because someone is broken doesn't mean that the rebound means nothing. She loved the crazy bastard! LOL

[fuchsiaRose]

So glad I'm not the only one who thinks so LOL. I mean hell, I could sleep with anyone I wanted to just because my heart was broken and it not be any fault of my own? Hell yes! Bring on the Lana Lang Logic!

*shakes head*
Exactly.

This type of reasoning is so illogical that it actually baffles me.

----- Added 39 Seconds later -----

Tsk tsk tsk, i never said that, Someone else did.
I'm saying that the realationship is the reason.
The relationship is the reason for what?

[thehenry89]

There's nothing wrong with disliking a charachter. It ceartinly doesn't make anyone pathetic, it just means that they have a different opinion then your own.

[Krypto~Luan]

The relationship is the reason for what?

For her going to lex. She was hurting with her realtionship with clark, not BECAUSE of clark :D

[pizzahead2490]

She was hurting. Its not like she was thinking right.

oh come on!!! lana had feelings for lex and you know it

[fuchsiaRose]

For her going to lex. She was hurting with her realtionship with clark, not BECAUSE of clark :D

Okay, okay but stay with me on this one: Lana is emotionally hurt. Lana chooses to sleep with Lex. How is that Clark's direct responsibility? He doesn't control Lana. He didn't make her think that sleeping with another man was a solution.

[Krypto~Luan]

oh come on!!! lana had feelings for lex and you know it

:lol: Dont deny that either!

[MAN-of-STEEL]

MAN there is more DRAMA here than on Smallville. Quite entertaining:rotfl:

[Krypto~Luan]

Okay, okay but stay with me on this one: Lana is emotionally hurt. Lana chooses to sleep with Lex. How is that Clark's direct responsibility? He doesn't control Lana. He didn't make her think that sleeping with another man was a solution.

:lol:Im not saying its his fault, she thought she was in love with him(lex) because she was filling the void.
Like people wo fill voids using drugs. Though i think some people woulf find lex less addicting then a drug :\

[fuchsiaRose]

oh come on!!! lana had feelings for lex and you know it

Did they ever! Sometimes I felt I was watching soft core porn...like in Instinct. Not that I know anything about soft core porn... heh...heh... ;)

[Krypto~Luan]

MAN there is more DRAMA here than on Smallville. Quite entertaining:rotfl:

:rotfl:

----- Added 35 Seconds later -----

Did they ever! Sometimes I felt I was watching soft core porn...like in Instinct. Not that I know anything about soft core porn... heh...heh... ;)

:rotfl:true

[MAN-of-STEEL]

But I WILL add this Drama beats out Smallville any day.

[fuchsiaRose]

:lol:Im not saying its his fault, she thought she was in love with him because she was filling the void.
Like people wo fill voids using drugs. Though i think some people woulf find lex less addicting then a drug :\
Okay so then let me ask this again:

Do you believe that Lana CHOSE to sleep with Lex?

In other words, did the woman make this decision and is therefore responsible for any consequences said relationship brought with it?

Because my beef was with the notion that Clark is to blame for Lana sleeping with Lex. Clark could have broken Lana's heart into a million pieces then ran it over with that tractor he's ALWAYS fixing then lasered it his heat vision (ie..you know, like how he signed Garth's auto--Clark, the show off! :lol:) and then I don't know...boiled it in poison and that still would NOT make him responsible for Lana's actions because Lana is a grown woman capable of making her own choices.

[you_smell_terrific]

Did they ever! Sometimes I felt I was watching soft core porn...like in Instinct. Not that I know anything about soft core porn... heh...heh... ;)

LMAO!!

Yeah I still can't get over that scene in fracture when Clark is being 'forced' to watch Lana and Lex have sex. Forced so much so that even after Lex lets him go he can't help but turn and stare some more LMAO!!

[fuchsiaRose]

MAN there is more DRAMA here than on Smallville. Quite entertaining:rotfl:
If you think there's drama here check out the "baby mama" thread! LOL. Where in the world is this pregnancy theory coming from?? :lol:

----- Added 58 Seconds later -----

LMAO!!

Yeah I still can't get over that scene in fracture when Clark is being 'forced' to watch Lana and Lex have sex. Forced so much so that even after Lex lets him go he can't help but turn and stare some more LMAO!!
That was SO twisted man. You know the writers had to go to a dark place to write that one! :lol:

[Krypto~Luan]

Okay so then let me ask this again:

Do you believe that Lana CHOSE to sleep with Lex?

In other words, did the woman make this decision and is therefore responsible for any consequences said relationship brought with it?

Because my beef was with the notion that Clark is to blame for Lana sleeping with Lex. Clark could have broken Lana's heart into a million pieces then ran it over with that tractor he's ALWAYS fixing then lasered it his heat vision (ie..you know, like how he signed Garth's auto--Clark, the show off! :lol:) and then I don't know...boiled it in poison and that still would NOT make him responsible for Lana's actions because Lana is a grown woman capable of making her own choices.Once again to clarify, calrk was not the direct result.

Secondly, the rational thought was not there. So she cose out of her better judgment, Its actually fairly obvious.

Ive seen people in real life do worse for less.:\

But she did belive se loved him. Perhaps convinced herself of it. Love is always true, but healthy...not so much.

[fuchsiaRose]

Once again to clarify, calrk was not the direct result.

Secondly, the rational thought was not there. So she cose out of her better judgment, Its actually fairly obvious.

Ive seen people in real life do worse for less.:\

But she did belive se loved him. Perhaps convinced herself of it. Love is always true, but healthy...not so much.
Well yes obviously her judgment was seriously skewed. I would never argue otherwise. I'm just not going to give Clark blame for a decision made by an adult person.

[Krypto~Luan]

Well yes obviously her judgment was seriously skewed. I would never argue otherwise. I'm just not going to give Clark blame for a decision made by an adult person.

Niether am i, you have me mistaken for someone else.

[fuchsiaRose]

Love is always true, but healthy...not so much.
Aww, that's kind of sad. :(

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----

Niether am i, you have me mistaken for someone else.

:rotfl:

Yeah, that's probably what happened. It was another poster who probably said it and I thought it was you!

In my defense, er, it's almost gonna be 1 am here. Me sleepy!

[Liquid-Prince]

:rotfl: Umm Ok whatever helps YOU sleeps better at night. I am however intrested in Lanas secret. Im hoping it will be good

I sleep like a baby, don't you worry.

[fuchsiaRose]

^^^ Then I envy you. Yesterday and today I haven't been able to sleep well! :(

[Krypto~Luan]

Aww, that's kind of sad. :(

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----



:rotfl:

Yeah, that's probably what happened. It was another poster who probably said it and I thought it was you!

In my defense, er, it's almost gonna be 1 am here. Me sleepy!

Lol its 1:39 here lol and im sick, but i enjoyed our convo.

And the "heatly unhealthy" relationsip is sad, I learned that in abusive relationships, (lanas and lex's for example)

Love IS there, but its not good for the individual.

A woman form the My Sisters Place (the abusive relationshp help clinic) Told my class, that noone should ever thing the love isnt there, but its blinding them fromt he truth. It actually is really sad. Lana should consider herself lucky.

[Atomic girl]

MOD NOTE: This thread has been taken off topic way too much. Keep it on topic or it will be closed.

[Sunny8]

Thanks for this post, fuschia!

I think the problem is that Lana comes back and all of a sudden the writers write to make her look good, and it ends up making everyone else look bad.

I think the point is not that Lana as a character makes Clark regress, but that Lana's presence in the script causes the writers to want to write her up and make her the voice of wisdom, the positive influence, the girl that deserves to be up on that pedestal, and suddenly Clark comes off as dumb, and whoever else is around Lana comes off as dumb.

That whole having Lana advise Clark on not killing, especially one episode after she's lecturing Oliver on not killing... (and not killing LEX, who she tried to kill last season for cripes' sake!) it's just bad writing. It's inconsistent with the way she is sometimes written, and it's basically written in a way to showcase the awesome holiness that is Lana for one of her last episodes.

The problem is that I don't understand how the writers can be so amazing in some ways, but somehow they have this weird fetish for Lana and just write her in all these bizarre ways and then write other characters in these ways that make the other characters look bad so as to make Lana look good.

I just don't get it. At all.

I totally agree. The writers 'Mary Sue' Lana so much that people hate her. They need to look at the wikipedia definition for Mary Sue. I know that wikipedia is not always right but they explain Mary Sue so well that Lana should have her picture placed there.

----- Added 11 Minutes later -----


Catering. They are catering to Kristin Kreuk, to the clana fans are perhaps to AlMiles.

No one knows for certain WHY they are doing it but it's annoying and just plain regressive.

I hate to think that but it might be true. I always wonder if KK were not so pretty if they would have put her at the center of attention so much. It seems to me that originally AlMiles wanted to make a series about Clark Kent's journey from his teen years to when he becomes the superhero. But when they saw KK the show became about her character Lana because of what KK looks like. In saying this I do not think anything bad about KK. I think she is a very intelligent young lady who is just trying to do her job. But if she did not look the way she looks would she even have lasted as long as she has as Lana?

----- Added 24 Minutes later -----


Plus Clark had the whispers of the Legion in his and head, and all this caused a moment of weakness, in which he suddenly realized what an idiot he was being when Lana kicked him in the butt.

But if it were Lana the Legion had talked about killing would he have had this moment of weakness? I think not. In season 7, when Lana was possessed by Brainiac Clark could have killed her to put her out of her pain and misery but the thought never crossed his mind because it was his beloved Lana. Now a year later he's regressing and not only thinking about killing a human being, but killing his BFF Chloe. It does not sit right with me for Clark's character to even have considered that. That is why I agree that he has been regressed to make Lana seem so good and wise.

----- Added 46 Minutes later -----

Yeah, instead Chloe ended her relationship with clark before it ever really started, then guilted him over it when it was HER that made the choice, not him. She also joined forces with Lionel while in a jealous rage after Clark started dating Lana, tried to use her "truth" abilities to discover Clark's secret, and in addition she kept Clark's location in metropolis a secret from both Lana & his parents for 3 months. She's a real saint. LOL

No Chloe is has human faults and is no saint. Unlike how that the writers try to make Lana out to be. That is why Lana is loathed by so many.

----- Added 57 Minutes later -----

No one forced Lana Lang to sleep with Lex Luthor prior to the wedding.

And no one forced her to marry Lex either. Just because Lionel said he would kill Clark if she did not marry Lex did not mean that she had to marry Lex. She could have easily gone to Clark and told him what Lionel threatened to do to see what he had to say about it before she took that step towards the altar.

What bothered me most was that she decided on the day of the wedding to try to call it off when she had every opportunity beforehand to do so. Even Lex, as evil as he is, did not deserve that kind of treatment. Lionel had a right to say something to her about it even if it wasn't right for him to threatened her or Clark's life. Of course that is another episode and should be discussed elsewhere but I just wanted to add that in.:D

----- Added 1 Hours and 2 Minutes later -----

Clark knew that Lex had a thing for Lana and was seducing her, and he broke up with her and basically tossed her into Lex's arms. Hurt from the brutal breakup, Lana found a temporary solace in Lex, and mistook it for passionate love.

Where and when did Clark toss Lana at Lex? He broke up with her and wanted her to have another relationship with someone nice. Aren't there other men in Smallville? She went to Lex of her own free will because deep down she knew that Clark did not like Lex and she wanted to hurt him. She hurt herself by trying to hurt Clark.

----- Added 1 Hours and 9 Minutes later -----

Okay so then let me ask this again:

Do you believe that Lana CHOSE to sleep with Lex?

In other words, did the woman make this decision and is therefore responsible for any consequences said relationship brought with it?

Because my beef was with the notion that Clark is to blame for Lana sleeping with Lex. Clark could have broken Lana's heart into a million pieces then ran it over with that tractor he's ALWAYS fixing then lasered it his heat vision (ie..you know, like how he signed Garth's auto--Clark, the show off! :lol:) and then I don't know...boiled it in poison and that still would NOT make him responsible for Lana's actions because Lana is a grown woman capable of making her own choices.

I don't know fushiaRose. Maybe people are trying to say how dumb Lana is because saying that Clark is the reason why she slept with Lex makes her look dumb and pathetic. Also, for those saying she was just filling a void, she should have taken drugs instead. They couldn't have done her any more harm than her being with Lex did.

[Mr.Magic]

I wish the writers of Supernatural would write for Clark's character. At least they know how to write for men.

That is little wonder. Some of the Supernatural staff worked on Lois & Clark.

[joemamma]

Clark Kent once again regresses and not by mere coincidence is it in an episode with Lana Lang.

Was I the only one who did a double take when Clark actually was shown contemplating to kill Chloe?? I was like "What???" I had a flashback of Lana telling Clark that Lex had to die, that she had to kill him because he was evil and that he'd end up killing more people. I remembered her telling Clark that unlike him she would DO something about it. And I remember Clark standing firm and not agreeing that killing was ever a choice. This was just last season!!! And I remembered Chloe in many instances urging Clark to take a similar action and yet Clark refused to listen. Then I also had a flashback of Lex Luthor unconscious while the Green Arrow approached, unyielding and wanting to finish him off. To kill Lex Luthor once and for all. Clark Kent stopped him. Clark Kent does not murder. He does not kill.

IN ALL INSTANCES, WITH LANA, CHLOE AND OLIVER, CLARK KNEW BETTER AND DID NOT CONDONE KILLING. EVER. NOT EVEN IN EXTREME SITUATIONS.


Now here, suddenly Clark is doubting something that since day one he has known and believed in? I mean this is no doubt what his parents instilled in him. And yet it's suddenly gone here?? And to top it off, who is the voice of reason? Lana Lang!!! The person who HAS been shown to think that killing someone IS an option. The person who has kidnapped, tortured, stolen. She's the voice of reason? She's the person who knows BETTER than Clark Kent?? :confused:


*shakes head*

And yet people still say that when Lana Lang is around Clark Kent does NOT regress. MOD EDIT

Every time that Lana is around Clark it seems like she HAS to guide him. She HAS to instill in him wisdom. She HAS to show him the way. She HAS to tell him what to do. He's an adult now! He's at the Daily Planet! He's a grown man and it's been 8 years since the show started and Clark still can't think for himself???? Even though he was doing JUST that before Lana? I mean go back to COMMITTED for a second. Clark was investigating. Clark was thinking. Clark was not questioning his morals. Clark was being the character we all know and love.

Now a few episodes later. Lana is back and Clark is suddenly confused? And it's not like this CHLOIAC business is even the worst he's had to deal with. There is no reason why Lana had to be yet again telling Clark what was the right choice.

Clark should know better already. And Clark DOES know better already.

But the second you stick that raven woman in his life he regresses.

Regression is what Lana Lang is to this series.

Regression.

I gotta say fuchsiaRose, you really hit the nail on the head with this analysis.

Lana's "sage advice" had me pulling my hair out!

It's obvious to me that she's being written up all noble to make up for her shady past on the show, at the expense of friggin' Superman for crying out loud! I mean, is it really worth it to appease lana fans at the expense of the main character?

*rubbing temples* just breathe *takes a deep breath* three more epi's and she's gone

[BadaBingBadaBoomsday]

Clark Kent once again regresses and not by mere coincidence is it in an episode with Lana Lang.

Was I the only one who did a double take when Clark actually was shown contemplating to kill Chloe?? I was like "What???" I had a flashback of Lana telling Clark that Lex had to die, that she had to kill him because he was evil and that he'd end up killing more people. I remembered her telling Clark that unlike him she would DO something about it. And I remember Clark standing firm and not agreeing that killing was ever a choice. This was just last season!!! And I remembered Chloe in many instances urging Clark to take a similar action and yet Clark refused to listen. Then I also had a flashback of Lex Luthor unconscious while the Green Arrow approached, unyielding and wanting to finish him off. To kill Lex Luthor once and for all. Clark Kent stopped him. Clark Kent does not murder. He does not kill.

IN ALL INSTANCES, WITH LANA, CHLOE AND OLIVER, CLARK KNEW BETTER AND DID NOT CONDONE KILLING. EVER. NOT EVEN IN EXTREME SITUATIONS.


Now here, suddenly Clark is doubting something that since day one he has known and believed in? I mean this is no doubt what his parents instilled in him. And yet it's suddenly gone here?? And to top it off, who is the voice of reason? Lana Lang!!! The person who HAS been shown to think that killing someone IS an option. The person who has kidnapped, tortured, stolen. She's the voice of reason? She's the person who knows BETTER than Clark Kent?? :confused:


*shakes head*

And yet people still say that when Lana Lang is around Clark Kent does NOT regress. MOD EDIT

Every time that Lana is around Clark it seems like she HAS to guide him. She HAS to instill in him wisdom. She HAS to show him the way. She HAS to tell him what to do. He's an adult now! He's at the Daily Planet! He's a grown man and it's been 8 years since the show started and Clark still can't think for himself???? Even though he was doing JUST that before Lana? I mean go back to COMMITTED for a second. Clark was investigating. Clark was thinking. Clark was not questioning his morals. Clark was being the character we all know and love.

Now a few episodes later. Lana is back and Clark is suddenly confused? And it's not like this CHLOIAC business is even the worst he's had to deal with. There is no reason why Lana had to be yet again telling Clark what was the right choice.

Clark should know better already. And Clark DOES know better already.

But the second you stick that raven woman in his life he regresses.

Regression is what Lana Lang is to this series.

Regression.



</RANT>

I think you've got your cause and effect the wrong way round.

Lana was the one that convinced Clark not to kill Chloe.

How can you say Lana is the cause of Clark thinking about killing Chloe when shes been away for so long, and only just returned?

Clark has been influenced and has had his head filled with **** by Lois Lane while Lana has been away and it takes Lana to come back to notice this and set him back on the right track.:)

[Mickey_Bickey]

When a guest star is more captivating than the lead actor, you know something's wrong!

Rokk had all the traits that I so desperately wanted to see Clark have in this episode. Alpha male, confident, secure, wise, and I could go on.

What we saw in Clark's character was pure regression. They completely sacraficed Clark's character to put emphasis on Lana.

Isn't this series supposed to be about Clark? I can't believe they would mess up such an important episode like this with potentially new fans tuning in to see the young Superman!

If I didn't watch this show, I would have thought what Garth said, "I don't know. Do we have the right guy? Because he's no Man of Steel"!

[BadaBingBadaBoomsday]

When a guest star is more captivating than the lead actor, you know something's wrong!

Rokk had all the traits that I so desperately wanted to see Clark have in this episode. Alpha male, confident, secure, wise, and I could go on.

What we saw in Clark's character was pure regression. They completely sacraficed Clark's character to put emphasis on Lana.

Isn't this series supposed to be about Clark? I can't believe they would mess up such an important episode like this with potentially new fans tuning in to see the young Superman!

If I didn't watch this show, I would have thought what Garth said, "I don't know. Do we have the right guy? Because he's no Man of Steel"!

And whats wrong with that? Smallville has been like that from the start, hes not Superman YET!

Smallville is all about Superman learning and showing us how he became the man he was, how he was born with flaws that were corrected by various characters to become the great hero he is. I think thats what makes Smallville special, afterall he is known as the BDA (sorry) and we enjoy a laugh at him sometimes.

If he was perfect all the time, we would be saying Clark doesn't need LL, LL, CS or the Legion but Smallville says he does, and this was highlighting why.

Smallville would be a duller place without his imperfections.

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----

Why is everybody saying Clarks regressing? Hes not, everything he does is for his progress towards Superman.

[Mickey_Bickey]

And whats wrong with that? Smallville has been like that from the start, hes not Superman YET!

Smallville is all about Superman learning and showing us how he became the man he was, how he was born with flaws that were corrected by various characters to become the great hero he is. I think thats what makes Smallville special, afterall he is known as the BDA (sorry) and we enjoy a laugh at him sometimes.

If he was perfect all the time, we would be saying Clark doesn't need LL, LL, CS or the Legion but Smallville says he does, and this was highlighting why.

Smallville would be a duller place without his imperfections.

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----

Why is everybody saying Clarks regressing? Hes not, everything he does is for his progress towards Superman.

What's wrong with the main character regressing and not moving forward towards becoming Superman? Everything!

Bottom line, Clark's character was sacraficed the better good of Lana, and I have huge problem with that. I was hoping the writers wouldn't do this, but unfortunately they did. I believe I heard they wanted to do something different, but KK had a lot of input in Lana's character and pushed her agenda. The writers should have emphasized that this series is about Clark, not Lana.

There was no progression towards Superman that I saw last night. Only people telling him about what he is going to become. Even Chloe's storyline was sacraficed last night. There was hardly a mention of what happened to her. Like Badtoad said, they brushed it under the rug. I'm just upset that the episode should have revolved more around the Legion, Clark, Chloe, Brainiac and Doomsday. Instead, they put the emphasis all on Lana. When that happens, it sacrafices Clark's character. It always has, and unfortunately it doesn't look like it will ever be any different. It's my opinion. We don't have to agree.

[blackcelebration]

When a guest star is more captivating than the lead actor, you know something's wrong!

Rokk had all the traits that I so desperately wanted to see Clark have in this episode. Alpha male, confident, secure, wise, and I could go on.

What we saw in Clark's character was pure regression. They completely sacraficed Clark's character to put emphasis on Lana.

Isn't this series supposed to be about Clark? I can't believe they would mess up such an important episode like this with potentially new fans tuning in to see the young Superman!

If I didn't watch this show, I would have thought what Garth said, "I don't know. Do we have the right guy? Because he's no Man of Steel"!


I have to agree and disagree with that!

My main argument is that although there was no real progress for clark becoming Superman, what was good was when he lectured them about not killing, which is an important, if not the most important principle of Superman.

Indeed, by episodes end, the Legion were making the "Not Killing" rule their most important priority, meaning yes, Clark as a character hadn't really changed, but Clark Kent had changed those around him, which again is another important part of Superman, reminding us humans of what it is that makes us human

As for emphasis on Lana, that was annoying but lasted barely 5 minutes in the episode... just think only three more to go and if they are like that then all the better for it. But Lana's character is for all together different thread

----- Added 6 Minutes later -----

What's wrong with the main character regressing and not moving forward towards becoming Superman? Everything!

Bottom line, Clark's character was sacraficed the better good of Lana, and I have huge problem with that. I was hoping the writers wouldn't do this, but unfortunately they did. I believe I heard they wanted to do something different, but KK had a lot of input in Lana's character and pushed her agenda. The writers should have emphasized that this series is about Clark, not Lana.

There was no progression towards Superman that I saw last night. Only people telling him about what he is going to become. Even Chloe's storyline was sacraficed last night. There was hardly a mention of what happened to her. Like Badtoad said, they brushed it under the rug. I'm just upset that the episode should have revolved more around the Legion, Clark, Chloe, Brainiac and Doomsday. Instead, they put the emphasis all on Lana. When that happens, it sacrafices Clark's character. It always has, and unfortunately it doesn't look like it will ever be any different. It's my opinion. We don't have to agree.

Lana was an annoyance in this episode, I'll admit that, but her screen time was barely five minutes... I know, even that's too long:rotfl:

Honestly, I always thought the mind wipe idea was terrible, so I'm kinda glad they wrote it out, ok it was done quickly but for me if it's bad, get rid of it before it becomes worse.

Err There was a lot of Brainiac and Doomsday, maybe you missed the end by Doomsday came crashing out of The Fortress!

But I do agree with you that if the final three episodes are Clana based then it really will regress the Clark character.

[DGirlLois4Clark]

I can vote in this poll as I dont think Clark regressed or progressed. It was a great episode minus the Lana worship.

[Mickey_Bickey]

I have to agree and disagree with that!

My main argument is that although there was no real progress for clark becoming Superman, what was good was when he lectured them about not killing, which is an important, if not the most important principle of Superman.

Indeed, by episodes end, the Legion were making the "Not Killing" rule their most important priority, meaning yes, Clark as a character hadn't really changed, but Clark Kent had changed those around him, which again is another important part of Superman, reminding us humans of what it is that makes us human

As for emphasis on Lana, that was annoying but lasted barely 5 minutes in the episode... just think only three more to go and if they are like that then all the better for it. But Lana's character is for all together different thread

----- Added 6 Minutes later -----



Lana was an annoyance in this episode, I'll admit that, but her screen time was barely five minutes... I know, even that's too long:rotfl:

Honestly, I always thought the mind wipe idea was terrible, so I'm kinda glad they wrote it out, ok it was done quickly but for me if it's bad, get rid of it before it becomes worse.

Err There was a lot of Brainiac and Doomsday, maybe you missed the end by Doomsday came crashing out of The Fortress!

But I do agree with you that if the final three episodes are Clana based then it really will regress the Clark character.

Lana had quite a few of those 5 minute scenes. I would have liked to see the show end with Clark speaking more with Chloe about what happened. It just seemed to be rushed and trivialized.

We'll see how the next 3 episodes go, but I'm with you if it's the same old song and dance like last night, then I'm afraid there's going to be a lot of disenchanted Clark fans out there.

[kate_lang]

Is really funny crazy some people are...

The person who has kidnapped, tortured, stolen. She's the voice of reason? She's the person who knows BETTER than Clark Kent
Yes, after his parents, lana is the person who knows clark better and vice e versa.
Don't talk like lana was the only made mistake because everyone made mistake and you prefer doesn't see it... Oh i know why..:rolleyes:

If he was perfect all the time, we would be saying Clark doesn't need LL, LL, CS or the Legion but Smallville says he does, and this was highlighting why.

Smallville would be a duller place without his imperfections.

Why is everybody saying Clarks regressing? Hes not, everything he does is for his progress towards Superman.

Agree! The problem is because lana.. Clois fans have a hard time to accept it.

[Kal-ed]

What I didnt like was: anything

Of course there´s Ageless, Promise, Sleeper to name a few, yet this is one of the worst episodes Ive ever seen in Smallville, jeez, it couldnt have been worse, the "Chlloe should die" but then she can be saved crap is horrible, wether Chloe changed her name or died, Chloe Sullivan should still be on the books. I think that what they were trying to portray is how Clark, based on his principles changed history and Chloe survived, how ever, the fact that the Legion hadnt heard about Chloe made for the whole thing an inconsistency, like I said, even if Clark hadnt managed to save her and she had been slayed to defeat Brainiac, she still would have been known, her place as Clark´s best friend during highschool and afterwards is undeniable, so either the Legion didnt know their history well, or this episosode was poorly thought through.

I didnt want Chloe to die, that´s for sure yet given the way the episode was structured, its the only thing that would have made sense. Plus Chloe remembering Clark´s secret without explanation of how she regained that knowledge, is bull, sure we can make a safe guess of how she recovered the moemories, how ever it would be mere speculation and nothing more. The thing is, I dont know what type of Clark the Legion inherited but the "preserve life at all costs" is sort of a given for the average Clark, so I dont really get how they managed to miss that huge part of Superman´s credo.


For me, this epi made the top ten worst episodes ever. Horrible, the Legion was a joke.

Two things I liked, the fact that Clark got the best of the Legion, dispite them obviously having no clue as to what Clark stood for (Im just going to ignore the fact that the legion had actually no guidelines based on the SUperman I know, the no killing clause should be a given for people following Superman, not a surprise) and the heat vision autograph.

[Xanusus]

How is it out of character when he's never been in that situation before? It would only be regression if he actually killed her, he didn't break his own personal rules, he didn't even bend them a little.

Well let's see. Way back in "Pariah" Clark almost killed a terrible VILLAIN. He was seriously contemplating it way back then. In other words he HAD his moment of doubt already.

Lois showed up and stayed his hand and talked him out of it. LESSON supposedly LEARNED. Clark from that moment on should have NEVER had any more moments of doubt. Contemplating whether killing someone is the right thing to do or not should have stopped from that moment on.

Now 3 seasons later and years later as a GROWN UP he's still having issues with this and contemplating murder AGAIN? And this time a decision that not only involves a villain BUT his BEST FRIEND to boot?

BALONEY! It's regression. And of course Lana is the voice of reason. Once again getting propped up at Clark's expense.

[Kal-ed]

Xanus you are forgetting the bigges example, Combat, he wanted to kill Titan and he beat up some meteor freks, just cause he was frustrated at the Lexana wedding. I stll dont mind Clark´s attitude about not letting the Legion kill Chloe, its the way things were handeled.

Clark against the persuader was a big fat joke, why even bother having him in the episode.

That said, Im very glad Clark showed the Legion the value of life, that aspect of the episode I really liked.

Oh and I really enjoyed the Brainy (Brainiac 5) reference.

[blackcelebration]

Well let's see. Way back in "Pariah" Clark almost killed a terrible VILLAIN. He was seriously contemplating it way back then. In other words he HAD his moment of doubt already.

Lois showed up and stayed his hand and talked him out of it. LESSON supposedly LEARNED. Clark from that moment on should have NEVER had any more moments of doubt. Contemplating whether killing someone is the right thing to do or not should have stopped from that moment on.

Now 3 seasons later and years later as a GROWN UP he's still having issues with this and contemplating murder AGAIN? And this time a decision that not only involves a villain BUT his BEST FRIEND to boot?

BALONEY! It's regression. And of course Lana is the voice of reason. Once again getting propped up at Clark's expense.


There is a little difference.... Pariah was a Meteor Freak whilst Legion had Brainiac, there's a bit of a difference there!

This episode kind off reminded me of Perry and Run, where both Perry, and Impulse need Clark to redeem their characters. Here Clark redeems The Legion by reminding them that killing should never be the only option.

[jimmyolsenblues]

i don't think lana ruined this episode....just the scenes she was in with that silly wig....

[Kid Collins]

I think you've got your cause and effect the wrong way round.

Lana was the one that convinced Clark not to kill Chloe.

How can you say Lana is the cause of Clark thinking about killing Chloe when shes been away for so long, and only just returned?

Clark has been influenced and has had his head filled with **** by Lois Lane while Lana has been away and it takes Lana to come back to notice this and set him back on the right track.:)

Sweet especially about the annoying Lois part. :cool:

Clark wasn't turned into a BDA by Lana in this ep. She only backed him up on his original decision that he had to save Chloe at all cost! But it was Clark who ended up finding a way to save Chloe.

Lana talked to Clark and gave him advise. If his parents were around or Chloe he would've had that same talk with them that he had with Lana.

Clark doesn't have all the answers. That's what his friends, family are there for. To give him feedback, advise, etc. He doesn't exist in a vacuum.

[stenochick]

I think the writers are trying to convey that Lana, and other characters in other episodes, have been so influenced by Clark that they have internalized his ethical standards and morals and can remind him when he is in moments of crisis.

It comes off as Lana-worship because the writers have been so inconsistent with writing her character. She goes from victim to loony sociopath to Mary Sue depending on the plot. They also switch Lana and Chloe back and forth depending on the story.
I think if the Legion had not kept drilling it into his head that Chloe had to be killed in order to protect the entire world for the next millenia, he would not have wavered.

Once again, Clark has the weight of the world thrust upon his shoulders without ever asking for that responsibility. Jor-el and, for whatever reason, Martian Manhunter are not available for insight, so he has to rely on the teenage aliens from the 31st century. Lana was just echoing his own voice of reason outside of his head.

It was Clark who decided that between him and the Legion, they could save the world and save Chloe. He pushed the Legion to think outside the box and taught them a valuable lesson: that if you don't give in to fear and choose the ultimate good, that you will get the best result. You don't have to compromise.

[Xanusus]

Xanus you are forgetting the bigges example, Combat, he wanted to kill Titan and he beat up some meteor freks, just cause he was frustrated at the Lexana wedding. I stll dont mind Clark´s attitude about not letting the Legion kill Chloe, its the way things were handeled.

Clark against the persuader was a big fat joke, why even bother having him in the episode.

That said, Im very glad Clark showed the Legion the value of life, that aspect of the episode I really liked.

Oh and I really enjoyed the Brainy (Brainiac 5) reference.

I'm mainly saying that Clark shouldn't have regressed at all past that point in season 5. Actually we can go to "Vengeance" for another example of killing someone. Hence, this line from my post....

Clark from that moment on should have NEVER had any more moments of doubt.

"Vengeance" + "Pariah" should have been the turning point.

Yep "combat" is another lovely example of regression "post" lesson learned. I'll agree with you here.

The point I'm getting at is Clark doesn't need anymore pep talks about it. It's just makes him look weak. Resolving issues like this growing up when your a teenager is ok. I expect him to make mistakes and errors in judgment. But when you're a grown man with those experiences behind you it's time you were FIRM in your beliefs. Sorry they regressed Clark here badly and used Lana to do it.

[Krypto~Luan]

i don't think lana ruined this episode....just the scenes she was in with that silly wig....

Thats a wig? :lol:

[Isabel14]

Clark Kent once again regresses and not by mere coincidence is it in an episode with Lana Lang.

Was I the only one who did a double take when Clark actually was shown contemplating to kill Chloe?? I was like "What???" I had a flashback of Lana telling Clark that Lex had to die, that she had to kill him because he was evil and that he'd end up killing more people. I remembered her telling Clark that unlike him she would DO something about it. And I remember Clark standing firm and not agreeing that killing was ever a choice. This was just last season!!! And I remembered Chloe in many instances urging Clark to take a similar action and yet Clark refused to listen. Then I also had a flashback of Lex Luthor unconscious while the Green Arrow approached, unyielding and wanting to finish him off. To kill Lex Luthor once and for all. Clark Kent stopped him. Clark Kent does not murder. He does not kill.

IN ALL INSTANCES, WITH LANA, CHLOE AND OLIVER, CLARK KNEW BETTER AND DID NOT CONDONE KILLING. EVER. NOT EVEN IN EXTREME SITUATIONS.


Now here, suddenly Clark is doubting something that since day one he has known and believed in? I mean this is no doubt what his parents instilled in him. And yet it's suddenly gone here?? And to top it off, who is the voice of reason? Lana Lang!!! The person who HAS been shown to think that killing someone IS an option. The person who has kidnapped, tortured, stolen. She's the voice of reason? She's the person who knows BETTER than Clark Kent?? :confused:


*shakes head*

And yet people still say that when Lana Lang is around Clark Kent does NOT regress. MOD EDIT

Every time that Lana is around Clark it seems like she HAS to guide him. She HAS to instill in him wisdom. She HAS to show him the way. She HAS to tell him what to do. He's an adult now! He's at the Daily Planet! He's a grown man and it's been 8 years since the show started and Clark still can't think for himself???? Even though he was doing JUST that before Lana? I mean go back to COMMITTED for a second. Clark was investigating. Clark was thinking. Clark was not questioning his morals. Clark was being the character we all know and love.

Now a few episodes later. Lana is back and Clark is suddenly confused? And it's not like this CHLOIAC business is even the worst he's had to deal with. There is no reason why Lana had to be yet again telling Clark what was the right choice.

Clark should know better already. And Clark DOES know better already.

But the second you stick that raven woman in his life he regresses.

Regression is what Lana Lang is to this series.

Regression.




I so agree with you, but I guess we will see things change in the next episodes.

[Mickey_Bickey]

The point I'm getting at is Clark doesn't need anymore pep talks about it. It's just makes him look weak. Resolving issues like this growing up when your a teenager is ok. I expect him to make mistakes and errors in judgment. But when you're a grown man with those experiences behind you it's time you were FIRM in your beliefs. Sorry they regressed Clark here badly and used Lana to do it.

Exactly! What they did was sacrafice Clark's character for the greater good of Lana Lang, who's only purpose once again was to just bring Clark's character down. I was hoping to see such a change in this episode. What should have reflected more emphasis on Clark, the Legion and Chloe instead focussed more Lana . I can only imagine the sabotage of Clark's progression the next 3 episodes will have on him.

It was great to see Chloe get her memory back, but I wish that they spent a little more time on the aftermath of what happened to her, instead of rushing the conversation between her and Clark at the Talon.:(

[Krpyto]

Clark Kent once again regresses and not by mere coincidence is it in an episode with Lana Lang.

Was I the only one who did a double take when Clark actually was shown contemplating to kill Chloe?? I was like "What???" I had a flashback of Lana telling Clark that Lex had to die, that she had to kill him because he was evil and that he'd end up killing more people. I remembered her telling Clark that unlike him she would DO something about it. And I remember Clark standing firm and not agreeing that killing was ever a choice. This was just last season!!! And I remembered Chloe in many instances urging Clark to take a similar action and yet Clark refused to listen. Then I also had a flashback of Lex Luthor unconscious while the Green Arrow approached, unyielding and wanting to finish him off. To kill Lex Luthor once and for all. Clark Kent stopped him. Clark Kent does not murder. He does not kill.

IN ALL INSTANCES, WITH LANA, CHLOE AND OLIVER, CLARK KNEW BETTER AND DID NOT CONDONE KILLING. EVER. NOT EVEN IN EXTREME SITUATIONS.


Now here, suddenly Clark is doubting something that since day one he has known and believed in? I mean this is no doubt what his parents instilled in him. And yet it's suddenly gone here?? And to top it off, who is the voice of reason? Lana Lang!!! The person who HAS been shown to think that killing someone IS an option. The person who has kidnapped, tortured, stolen. She's the voice of reason? She's the person who knows BETTER than Clark Kent?? :confused:


*shakes head*

And yet people still say that when Lana Lang is around Clark Kent does NOT regress. MOD EDIT

Every time that Lana is around Clark it seems like she HAS to guide him. She HAS to instill in him wisdom. She HAS to show him the way. She HAS to tell him what to do. He's an adult now! He's at the Daily Planet! He's a grown man and it's been 8 years since the show started and Clark still can't think for himself???? Even though he was doing JUST that before Lana? I mean go back to COMMITTED for a second. Clark was investigating. Clark was thinking. Clark was not questioning his morals. Clark was being the character we all know and love.

Now a few episodes later. Lana is back and Clark is suddenly confused? And it's not like this CHLOIAC business is even the worst he's had to deal with. There is no reason why Lana had to be yet again telling Clark what was the right choice.

Clark should know better already. And Clark DOES know better already.

But the second you stick that raven woman in his life he regresses.

Regression is what Lana Lang is to this series.

Regression.



</rant>


How does Lana in any way contribute to this convulted thinking? She was the one who knew that Clark would make the right decision and encouraged him to do so.

Personally If I had to choose between saving billions of people or one person the choice would be clear.

Consider that Clark had Legion telling him the ONLY way to stop Braniac was to kill off Chloe. That might cause anyone to give pause. Clark may have hesitated and I think most anyone would second guess themselves when so many lives are at stake. But in the END Clark did the right thing.

SO GET OFF YOUR LANA BUSTING.

KK Thanks.

[miks]

I don't think he regressed at all. I think Lana did good this episode; she actually just gave him a little push on his first opinion and he finally ran completely with it. She did what Chloe and Martha would have done; just gave him a tiny bit of advice to push him forward. Good job Lana!

[blackcelebration]

I don't think he regressed at all. I think Lana did good this episode; she actually just gave him a little push on his first opinion and he finally ran completely with it. She did what Chloe and Martha would have done; just gave him a tiny bit of advice to push him forward. Good job Lana!

I think the problem is that the advice came from Lana. Kinda like when Lionel became Clark's moral guide after Jonathan's death:\

He'd just as well ask Shelby for advice, and then for the dog to go "Wolf" :rotfl:

[mrw66855]

I do not think she set any, but she did not progress him at all. You guys are forgetting what the show is about. It is about Clark Kent not kal-el. This is how I think of it. Clark Kent , and kal-el are separate people with separate personalities. Clark Kent is a human with kryptonian abilities, but he is not kryptonian. Due to this fact, he is unsure sometimes, what he should do (and sometimes to make sure we are doing the right thing we need somebody to tell us exactly what we are thinking to give us the confidence we need) and because Clark is a human he needs to have confidence. In contrast kal-el has confidence in himself and knows the right thing to do. That is why I believe lana brings out the Clark Kent personality, more. That being said, I do not think she sat kal-el back any because he is been in control for the past seven months (in the storyline terms). So he knows how to control the human within him and not let him get out of control. So, while lana is here will see a lot more of Clark Kent (bda, to some of you) and less kal-el (Superman). So I go back to my original statement, he will be at a neutral stage and not move forward, but I do not think he will never go back to where he was again. Remember, just my opinion.

[Mickey_Bickey]

Another thing, am I the only one that found it odd that she was in the barn in the first scene dressed in her party dress? Last we saw in Bride she was in a johnny at the hospital. That didn't make sense to me at all, and why was she picking up the bouquet again?:confused: Perhaps, always a bridesmaid, never a bride?

[Timester]

seriously, your outrage is almost understandable, but I disagree. It sounds like you think murder never even enters a hero's mind EVER...

Superman has killed before, under the most extreme circumstances, so it's not like it's unprecedented. He didn't like doing it, it tore him up for a long time afterward, but given the situation he did what he thought was right to save an innumerable number of people.

Faced with that same possibility, it's not inconceivable for someone even as righteous as Superman to consider killing. Even now, Batman has just resorted to murder to save the world from imminent doom.

The difference is ACTING on those thoughts. And from my perspective Lana is owed a debt of gratitude for reminding him to put his head back on straight before it was too late

ITA.

Clark DID killed in the past to save Pocket Earth.

[ClarkyBoy14]

They can't handle this show. They neglect the only character that actually matters - Clark. Nobody is going to tune in next week. There is nothing to tune in for. They yanked us back to season 7 going nowhereville.

I think that that's a bit of hyperbole. "Legion" was a very good episode for Clark, and he was for darn sure not neglected. ;)

As for the topic, I think it's just a matter of people not liking Lana. If Clark had the same conversation with Chloe or Ollie, then we would have just said, "Oh, he's expressing his inner turmoil/thoughts," but since it was Lana, then, of course, Clark has regressed.

----- Added 53 Seconds later -----

Another thing, am I the only one that found it odd that she was in the barn in the first scene dressed in her party dress? Last we saw in Bride she was in a johnny at the hospital. That didn't make sense to me at all, and why was she picking up the bouquet again?:confused: Perhaps, always a bridesmaid, never a bride?

I'm sure she didn't want to go home in the hospital gown, and the dress is the only thing she had. ;)

[Yoshua]

Disagree that it was because of Lana.


It was the Legion's doing. They came from the future and he thought they had all the answers. In the end he was right, as always. The legion told him he had to kill chloe. The legion left better people because of Clark Kent.


Clark always has doubts, that is why he doesn't fly yet. Until he stands firm in everything he is doing he will always need a sounding board.

Would it have been better for you if he had used Shelby as a sounding board? At least Lana could interract with him.

[Timester]

I think that that's a bit of hyperbole. "Legion" was a very good episode for Clark, and he was for darn sure not neglected. ;)

As for the topic, I think it's just a matter of people not liking Lana. If Clark had the same conversation with Chloe or Ollie, then we would have just said, "Oh, he's expressing his inner turmoil/thoughts," but since it was Lana, then, of course, Clark has regressed

Yep. I saw Diana and Bruce telling Clark the same thing in way worst matters and people cheered for Diana and Bruce.

[ClarkyBoy14]

Yep. I saw Diana and Bruce telling Clark the same thing in way worst matters and people cheered for Diana and Bruce.

Yah. Lana is far from my favorite character, and I dislike a lot of what they've done with her, but I hate it when she's unfairly bashed due to bias against her.

[Fly by guy]

What I got out of this episode is that Clark is the Superman he becomes because of the way he was raised and influenced by the people around him. He even had to lecture the Legion about the worth of life. Since Lana has been a HUGE influence on Clark, can't her detractors throw her a bone and say that it is possible that she helped mold Clark into the person he has become and not just the negative they feel towards her. If saving lives is Clarks big mission in the future, he sure got enough Practice saving Lana's butt.

If Clark wants to be a hero, does he really need a job at the Planet? Wouldn't be the Savior of the Planet require more than a couple of heroic acts a day, or week, or month? Shouldn't it be full time. Blame Lana for him wasting the last seven months she was gone on him being a copy boy in the basement instead of an all time, every time , any where hero.
Yeah, Lana. You had the good sense to get out of Smallville and darn you Arrow for telling her to come back. She doesn't need Clark bringing her down now that she's finally in a place in her life where she is happy and useful.

[Tompouce]

Regress for sure but at the end Clark makes his own decision, that is what matters...I feel it in that way...

[joel_welling93]

Finally when they are trying to redeem a character, that has been complained about so long, people are still not satisfied.... *sigh* Anyway, Lana Lang has been part of the series for 7 Seasons and I believe every character should get a good send off.... And that's what they are trying to do here..... But they did that by hurting Clark's character in the process....

Yes, it is quite unlike Clark to even think of taking someone else's life, what more his friend, and that part seemed like it wasn't even Clark... lol.... But I do agree that Clark's character was regressed to make space for Lana to help him progress.... I think the writers could have achieved that in a different way... By not regressing him.... More like both of them being on the same page.....

I dont think Lana made him regress at all.... He was already thinking of killing Chloe, Lana didn't tell him to kill Chloe.... She simply gave good advice... The kind that he could have thought up himself.... So if Clark regressed in this eppy at all, it definitely wasn't because of Lana.....

I think that that's a bit of hyperbole. "Legion" was a very good episode for Clark, and he was for darn sure not neglected. ;)

As for the topic, I think it's just a matter of people not liking Lana. If Clark had the same conversation with Chloe or Ollie, then we would have just said, "Oh, he's expressing his inner turmoil/thoughts," but since it was Lana, then, of course, Clark has regressed.

----- Added 53 Seconds later -----



I'm sure she didn't want to go home in the hospital gown, and the dress is the only thing she had. ;)

Totally agree with you....

[TJY09]

REGRESS REGRESS REGRESS REGRESS REGRESS REGRESS REGRESS.................I can keep on going but I can't wait to see her leave for good!

----- Added 5 Minutes later -----

How does Lana in any way contribute to this convulted thinking? She was the one who knew that Clark would make the right decision and encouraged him to do so.

Personally If I had to choose between saving billions of people or one person the choice would be clear.

Consider that Clark had Legion telling him the ONLY way to stop Braniac was to kill off Chloe. That might cause anyone to give pause. Clark may have hesitated and I think most anyone would second guess themselves when so many lives are at stake. But in the END Clark did the right thing.

SO GET OFF YOUR LANA BUSTING.

KK Thanks.





So you are saying Lana does not ruin the series? She is the reason that Clark's dad died and she is the reason Clark decided to keep his ass in Smallville! Please...............Lana makes Clark look like a idiot and I'm tired of her. That is why her boring ass is leaving Smallvile! 3 more episodes! I can't wait:p

[dru-zod2501]

REGRESS REGRESS REGRESS REGRESS REGRESS REGRESS REGRESS.................I can keep on going but I can't wait to see her leave for good!

----- Added 5 Minutes later -----







So you are saying Lana does not ruin the series? She is the reason that Clark's dad died and she is the reason Clark decided to keep his ass in Smallville! Please...............Lana makes Clark look like a idiot and I'm tired of her. That is why her boring ass is leaving Smallvile! 3 more episodes! I can't wait:p
Please Don't try and make sweeping generalizations. We're only discussing LEGION, where Lana was done well; this in no way negates or erases her past mistakes. For one episode, Lana did good

[fuchsiaRose]

Is this conversation still going on? Lol. Man this thread is huge!!!! Lol. :lol:

And the poll seems to say it all: Just about 70% of people are in favor of Lana Lang equaling regression.

I couldn't agree with ya'll more!!! :D

And now I'm moving on...feel free to continue discussing this until the cows come home or whatever the saying is!! Lol. I'm so bad at those! :lol: I'm done talking about Legion! I've just seen the new promo shots and they are awesome!!! They have put me in a fantabulous mood!!! :D:cool:


*skips along merrily*

[sithius]

I disagree with the results entirely.

I've only seen the episode once, but IIRC Clark said how killing was not an option before talking to Lana. When he went to go see her, he just explained what the LoSH had told him to do. He didn't look at her as if to say, 'gee, I might actually kill her Lana'. All she did was remind him that he's Clark Kent, and that he doesn't need to question his choices because he'll always end up making the right one. His moral code is in check, she merely reminded him of this. Everybody was telling him Chloe had to die, and because he isn't quite Superman yet, he was starting to doubt himself. We all know that he would have never killed Chloe though, Lana or no Lana.

If on the other hand he was donning the Superman outfit (and yes, I can picture Tom wearing it now :p) and standing in the ISIS foundation talking to Lana in this way, then yes, I would be pretty annoyed. But he isn't Superman yet, so he's not going to have 100% confidence until the journey is complete. :)

[Mickey_Bickey]

i don't think lana ruined this episode....just the scenes she was in with that silly wig....


:rotfl:

Alas, we learn her secret!

She whips off that wig to unveil a bald head! Lexana lives!

[unfocused]

I disagree with the results entirely.

I've only seen the episode once, but IIRC Clark said how killing was not an option before talking to Lana. When he went to go see her, he just explained what the LoSH had told him to do. He didn't look at her as if to say, 'gee, I might actually kill her Lana'. All she did was remind him that he's Clark Kent, and that he doesn't need to question his choices because he'll always end up making the right one. His moral code is in check, she merely reminded him of this. Everybody was telling him Chloe had to die, and because he isn't quite Superman yet, he was starting to doubt himself. We all know that he would have never killed Chloe though, Lana or no Lana.

If on the other hand he was donning the Superman outfit (and yes, I can picture Tom wearing it now :p) and standing in the ISIS foundation talking to Lana in this way, then yes, I would be pretty annoyed. But he isn't Superman yet, so he's not going to have 100% confidence until the journey is complete. :)

Good point.

And yes, we all know he was never going to kill Chloe, but I admit that I entertained the thought for a second, I'm sure many of us did and that's why that fear we had during that moment has turned to anger now (not for me, but for others I'm sure). But deep down, we all did know Clark was going to end up making the right choice, even if Lana wasn't there to help him try. He was fighting against the Legion the entire time so they wouldn't kill Chloe, on top of that the question of Clark choosing to end her life or risk billions of others came about. Clark admitted that it would have been a difficult decision to make, which is flat out telling us how much he cares about her. He was not going to kill her.

Every hero reaches a point where they doubt themselves. It can make for a great story, and has in many other storylines. The best part of those stories is that our hero always ends up making the right decisions and overcoming that doubt. And more often than not, fans are smart enough to know that it doesn't mean the hero is bad or immoral. It just means that even heroes can be weak sometimes, like us.

[zorasuperman]

gosh i was ok with lana in Bulletproof; she wasn't my favorite but i was like ehh whatever. but once I saw that kiss I was like sooo *#^&@^&@#^. lol. for PS3 to do that is not fair; i understand it is supposed to create drama and what not, but a lot of viewers who are tuning in are, at least thats how I'm seeing it, is because of the clois (or potential there of). and for ps3 to bring up the clana drama is just. *frustrated sigh here*. I have a feeling thats why the ratings went down a lot from legion. im sure many ppl were not pleased with the clana kiss. and you can tell that just from looking at the bride (albeit almost kiss, but still it was something) or from commited. if they wanted to create a love triangle i would have rather them bringing in lori lemaris, or even a monkey down the street. I don't object to lana being here, but at this point, there seems no other way. seems like if she's here, then as will drama. its just at this point its really frustrating for clark to STILL be hung over her; the guy does not have any.. well. brains. lol. y'all thought i was gonna say something else were ya? i mean its embarassing to have him hung over the same girl all his life; but wats even more embarassing is that she BROKE UP WITH HIM through a stupid video, and you still do not have any dignity and want to get back with her. I'm not saying be mean to your ex, but at least have some. well. thats my 2cents

[SGuthrie27]

Y'know, I haven't hardly EVER been a Clana fan (I'm a diehard Chlarker myself) but in my mind, Lana did NOT make Clark regress in this episode AT ALL. She helped spur him on to make the right decision and reminded him of the greatness inside of him. She's matured so much since the "secrets and lies" pouty Lana of early seasons, and she definitely didn't add to any sort of regression... at least not in this episode. Bulletproof, on the other hand...

--SGuthrie ><>' :)--

[disciples of zod]

I'll watch the next three episdoes, because I'm curious about how this whole clana thing will finally end.

me too! this Clana stuff is just getting REALLY old.

~H